Bodhran wanted

Bodhran wanted

I am trying to find the maker of a bodhran I recently saw at a session, the only markings on the drum, stamped in green ink on both the skin and the frame, was the name `drangonish`, all other lines of enquiry have turned up nothing, has anyone heard of this maker before ? the drum was purchased 4 years ago from a shop in the UK, I`ve contacted the shop and got nowhere. The drum cost £250.00 four years ago.

Re: Bodhran wanted

Where was the session?
Is there no chance of meeting the player again?
Any info on him/her?

(I love a good challenge - first we find this drummer,
then we try for Amelia Earhart.)

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Might it be one of Christian Hedwitschak’s instruments?

He makes a type of skin called "Dragonskin", and advertises it as such. This is off his website

"DRAGONSkin

In this case I am referring to a specially treated skin which is refined according to a special in-house treatment procedure. Only the most homogeneous and optically most attractive standard skins are selected for this purpose.
DRAGONSkin is a drum skin which has been well played-in from the very start but still has much more to offer. That special something extra which is difficult to describe in words. The sound-character can best be described as lively, harmonious with crystal-clear highs, a creamy mid-range tone and a full bass sound. It responds easily to the slightest touch of the skin hand and offers a very wide ranging sound spectrum. In comparison to the famous Lambeg skins from the North of Ireland, the attack is a bit softer.
DRAGONSkin is a copyright brand ! (TM)
After having worked on DRAGONSkins for over three years now, I have decided to differentiate more precisely between the skins and am now in a position to offer three distinct variations. The differences between the skins may be slight as the skin selection process is carried out meticulously and each skin dervies from a series of the same goatherd. However fundamental differences in sound and feeling do exist which should be of great interest especially to the more seasoned bodhran player.

DRAGONSkin classic: This is he standard DRAGONSkin model with a skin of of medium thickness and hardness. This ist he most popular and universally used HighEnd model with the typically creamy sound character. Even unexperienced players are well served with this model. Designed to suit from the session to the stage from „Long-and-slender-tippers" to “Hotrods”.

DRAGONSkin velvet: A "normal" DRAGONSkin-processing procedure. However, for this model we tend to use thinner and softer skins from younger animals.These skins have a softer feel thus reproducing a softer sound. Excellently suited for "bassline players" and to accompany the voice. Likewise suitable for spirituals and shamanic techniques..

DRAGONSkin spicy: Here we use thicker skins from older animals (3-7 years old). These are then sanded to medium thickness. This means that the portion of the harder outer skin layer is greater. In addition, the intensity of the DRAGONSkin procedure is shortened. The result is a DRAGONSkin with a harder attack, more punch even at louder sesions, but still with that creamy DRAGONSkin sound character. Maybe something more for the "topendstyle" player. Lucy Randall playing one of the very first DRAGONSkinspicy: Youtube.
Thanks to the Ausrian drum comapany beatfatory.at for permission to use the name "spicy" in this context! Excellent Djembes and more drum accesoires

Link : http://www.bodhranmaker.de/einblicke/drumskins.html#Dragonskin

Hope this helps. The price seems about right too

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"Likewise suitable for spirituals and shamanic techniques."

Ha ha ha.

(shooting fish in a barrel though)

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What in the world is a ‘creamy’ sound???

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What would the People for the Ethical Treatment of Dragons have to say about all of this?

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I thought dragons were an endangered species!

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"What in the world is a ‘creamy’ sound???"

The sound of marketing genius.

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Dragon bashers?!?!

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Thanks riverrunner, they look like the one`s I`m after

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Sean Connery made for a pretty good dragon. Craig Furgasen was pretty good in "How to Train your Dragon".

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Ancalagon the Black is turning over in his grave…..

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And St. George is seeing a business opportunity.

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So that’s what happened to Glaurung after he was killed. The real tragedy wasn’t the dude who slew him sleeping with his sister accidentally and then killing himself, it was his pals who found them later making the skin of the huge, dead dragon into thousands of bodhrans. His spirit is haunting sessions everywhere.


(I can out-Tolkien-geek you!)

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Damn! Geek point goes to Silver Spear!

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(the dude’s name being Turin — have to let you know that I know that :) )

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Shamanic techniques are supposed to bring it back to life, I suppose.

I suppose Lambeg drums are made out of Lambegs.

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God forbid anyone ever makes the Silmarillion into a movie and ruins that for me….then I’ll have to retreat back to reading the Prose Edda….

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…or Icelandic sagas….

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I think the chances of them making a movie out of the Silmarillion are (thankfully) minimal, as it never has had the mass popularity of the Lord of the Rings or the Hobbit — Tolkien geeks alone haven’t the numbers to make anything a box office hit — and it’s just too damned big.

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"I have decided to differentiate more precisely between the skins and am now in a position to offer three distinct variations."

So that makes a product line with 1-, 2- and 3-Skin bodhrans.

The next model must be the one that expands from pocket size when you stroke it.

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I thought this thread was going to say "Bodhran wanted…write your own joke here."

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Aaaarrrgh!!!

I just read this thread. I have about 40 pages left to read in Children of Hurin. Sigh.

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bollards

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I suppose Lambeg drums are made out of Lambegs.

# Posted on September 12th 2011 by nicholas

Yes, they are normally taken by spear, but some of them you have to trap.

Thus, "snare" drums.

We now return you to our featured program,
"The Dreaded Three-Headed Bodhran of Mustardshire".

Pray continue, folks, this is getting good.

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Only heard of bodhran skins… how do you hunt the beast itself ?

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I am prepared to admit that there are a lot of bodhran players and makers out there in the tossosphere.
Lots and lots.

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tossosphere??

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someone who rhymes with it is trying to ruin the lingua franka

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oops,sorry, franca w a n c a

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St George - patron saint of sessions?

Re: Nemesis of the Bodhran Dragons

In Northumbria, the beast was hunted to extinction by leaving maidens out for it, like this one:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2035802/Cheryl-shows-shes-got-X-Factor-stunning-calender-poses.html

They would lure the bodhran dragons into places where their strength and natural defences availed them naught, like into the middle of the central Newcastle motorway system or into the path of 1 zillion United fans chasing 1 zillion Sunderland fans onto a train after a six-nil defeat, and sit there watching them get shredded.

Northumbria seethes with dragon stories. This may not mean there were all that many dragons. It just indicates that people were obsessed with dragons. This is because dragons gave them an excuse to position very scantily clad maidens and expose them as objects of mass entertainment for an indefinite length of time. This tradition, of course, achieved unqualified commercial success and became mainstream.

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"Northumbria seethes with dragon stories"

Like this one, Nicholas?

Whisht! Lads, haad yor gobs,
An Aa’ll tell ye’s aall an aaful story
Whisht! Lads, haad yor gobs,
An’ Aa’ll tell ye ‘boot the worm.

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They used to show up in their human form to the Cumberland Arms.

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Pity they never ate the bodhran players. That would have solved a lot of problems.

;-)

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"The Legend of the Lambton Worm, Britain’s most unique and fully formed dragon legend, is told in an Arts and Crafts style. This story inspired many others, notably Bram Stoker’s Lair of the White Worm, and was an undisputed influence on Jabberwocky…"

The real Jabberwocky might not have been that dragon.

There is more of a chance that it was another dragon.

This one was called The Sockburn Worm and lived in the River Tees at (guess…) Sockburn.

Alternatively it might have lived, or possibly had a second home in, some ponds near Darlington called Hell’s Kettles.

Lewis Carrol, who *did* stay somewhere near to these two places, may have heard or read the story of the Sockburn Worm (for all I know, there may be a record that he did so) and been particularly influenced by it in his imagining of "Jabberwocky".

In the museum attached to Durham Cathedral reposes a Mediaeval cleaver with which someone is actually supposed to have killed the dragon. Called the Sockburn Falchion, it was ceremonially presented to each incoming Bishop of Durham till this was done away with in the 1830s. The last recipient Bishop was Van Mildert, who founded the University.

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*sigh* I must admit to being somewhat jealous of thsoe who live in ancient places with dragons and other fantastic creatures. A bodhran made from dragon skin sounds so much more interesting than a saying you made a bongo from Bigfoot.

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Durham University was founded in the 1830s?

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Some of the colleges are quite a bit older than that, but they all consolidated into a university around then.

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"Durham became one of the England’s leading centres of medieval scholarship, along with Oxford and Cambridge. Indeed, three Colleges - now part of Oxford University - were founded from Durham (University College and Balliol College, and in 1286 Durham College was run from Durham to train scholars for Durham for 300 years until it became incorporated into the University of Oxford as Trinity College). Henry VIII and Oliver Cromwell’s attempts to formally establish a University for the North in Durham were subsumed by politics and North-South rivalries, and it was not until 1832, as the Prince-Bishopric declined lost his powers, was Durham finally endowed with the Castle and lands and granted degree awarding powers by the king as England’s third University. Durham University is the inheritor of a continuous line of learning and scholarship dating from Bede and Cuthbert to the present day."

http://www.dur.ac.uk/about/shaped/

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Durham University:

Founded by Act of Parliament in 1832,
Granted a Royal Charter in 1837 (acc. Wiki).

Its antiquity, Harry Potter buildings, rugby, rowing etc. ensure that it fills up with noisy Oxbridge rejects. These are entirely harmless compared with the University itself, which is very happy to be part of the political and financial racket now running Durham.

The Mediaeval Bishops of Durham were viceroys with extensive powers. The Great Reform Bill put an end to these, for all that it was a long time since Bishops of Durham had actively wanted to wage war on the Scots, or even hunt deer in Weardale.

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Very good bodhrans though, just in case anyone`s interested, bodhrans being an integral part of ITM an` all. don`t play one myself, wish I could.

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"bodhrans being an integral part of ITM an` all."

I seriously hope you are taking the p*ss.

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no

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Fight! Fight!

The best sessions I have had are usually the ones where that indelible sound of a sack of tatties rolling down the stairs is delightfully absent.

Seriously, are they really "integral?" What would you do if the only people who showed up to a session one night were three bodhran players?

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Record them and sell it as the latest trad sensation.

Some suckers would buy it.

We’ve had three flutes, three mouth-organs, three who knows what else - surely it’s time for three bodhrans on their own…

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…And really lay on the ‘Niche’, ‘Cult’ etc. hype when you’re trying to flog it, of course…

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i would rather listen to three good bodhran players than three sh*te pipers, fiddlers or whistlers, so maybe its more of a reflection on the standard of bodhran players you usually encounter. bodhrans have been a part of ITM for long enough to be classed as integral, in my opinion. people dont like them because they have either never heard one played properly or they resent the fact that joe soap can buy one and be at a session ten minutes later joining in. the anti bodhran brigade will always exist and won`t hear a good word said about the instrument, thats if they even class it as an instrument. sad

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…said the person who has never experienced the joy of bodhran accompaniment to a waltz…..

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**snort**

…tossosphere…

mcknowall, you dog.

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Musicians don’t like them because they get in the way of the music. If you’re trying to play music and some tosser is pounding on his drum, it’s a damned nuisance, doesn’t matter who they are or how "well" they play. (I suppose there’s a difference between playing a bodhran "well" and playing it "poorly", but it’s a pretty slim difference when you’re playing good tunes and Goofy Godawful is sitting over there going "thumpathumpathumpa" and looking pleased with himself.)


"i would rather listen to three good bodhran players than three sh*te pipers, fiddlers or whistlers"

I’d really rather play with three musicians than three bodhran players, any day of the week. Lousy musicians, at least, are trying to do something worth doing, and with musicians there’s a chance of a tune.
Bodhran is tossery - you learn it to make money in a pub band, and that’s about all it’s good for.

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"they resent the fact that joe soap can buy one and be at a session ten minutes later joining in."

I think "resent" is the wrong word. Have been trying to think of a better one, such as "suffering in agony." Yes, I do hate that about bodhrans. I hate the fact that Joe Schmoe THINKS he can buy one and join in a session ten minutes later and sound completely awful and f u ck up the whole session. But hey, he’s enjoying it, grinning the whole way through the tune, oblivious to the fact that the melody players are sitting there wondering, "what musical gods did I p*ss off to deserve this?" Or possible just, "Feck off." For those of you who don’t really know how to play the bodhran, who just love the odd festival where you can batter that thing and have the best time in the world, that is probably what the melody players are thinking. You might be having fun, but they’re not. You’ve been warned.

"Integral" connotes that the music won’t work without it. The music works fine, better even, without bodhrans or any other accompaniment.

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I will, redundantly, echo SS, though not verbatim -

"Integral"?
What nonsense.

When down-sizing, start with the bodhrans.
Especially those who play up against guitars and zouks.
Pure mush, IMHO.

Then swing the scythe of good taste freely through the other backers, beginning with any guitarist who thinks more than one guitar is necessary or advisable at an open session.
The zouks can follow, slightly behind.

Hope I have not offended anyone.

Grumpily yours,

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I can buy a whistle or a fiddle or whatever and join into a session with that ten minutes later, and start noodling, and it will sound like crap. When you join in with a bodhran after ten minutes, it also sounds like crap. A bodhran should be approached like a musical instrument, that takes some time and talent to master, not something you just jump in and thump on. I don’t buy the argument that no drummer is a good drummer. Drums are limited in what they can contribute to a musical gathering, but that limit can be raised, and raised significantly, by someone who approaches it as a musician, and learns their craft.

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I thought for a moment that this thread had turned ugly but then realised he was joking-

"they resent the fact that joe soap can buy one[a bodhran] and be at a session ten minutes later joining in" and "i don`t play one myself, wish I could." Hahahahahahahahahehehehehewhewheeheeheehahaha….

Good one! Funny stuff. Love this site for the clever jokes…..

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I hope you are right, shanty, and I am the victim of having someone pulling my leg. Now that I think about it, a real person thinking that way does boggle the imagination. ;-)

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Al, to be honest, if you try to pick up the bodhran, you will in fact find that you learn everything there is to know about it very quickly. Ten minutes is more exaggeration than untruth.
This isn’t a good thing: what you can do with the bodhran is very limited, and if you’re not a total nincompoop you’ll have it down in no time.

What I’ve been trying to get clear on is, why people think that there’s something about the bodhran that anyone wants to hear. And I think it’s because they’ve been stupid enough to spend a few hundred bucks on a hoop with a skin stretched over it, and they have to convince themselves that it was worth the money. This is a pretty common finding in economics, I think: the more you pay for a thing, the more you value it, despite its actual worth (or, valuing a good based on sunk costs rather than potential return).

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One of the defining characteristics of the pro bodhranista’s argument is that they invariably blame the drum’s bad reputation on the many bad practitioners of the thing.

Not only is this pure arrogance - never does any bodhranista, good or bad, align themselves anywhere near the "bad" camp - it’s an astonishing self belief in their own self righteous right to belong.

It goes like this:
Bodranista sits down with some tune players and begins to thump away.

The tune players don’t like it and the honest ones say so. (Though not always … it beggars belief, but there are some tune players who like bodhrans. Each to there own of course)

Bodranista is aghast at not being rewarded with admiration. They are frustrated that they are not allowed to proove that they are not one of "bad" bodhran players.

Hyperbole aside, I’ve seen this happen a million times.

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"they invariably blame the drum’s bad reputation on the many bad practitioners of the thing."

Good point, IMHO. I would add that many drummers do not see the truth - not eveyone wants to hear, or play with, a bodhran, or not all the time. As in, I have no problem with dijereedoos, but I do not want them at a session, not all the time, or poorly applied/included.
I guess I am a mean person.

Perhaps part of the "arrogance" issue stems from some drummers apparent view that, "Oh - you disagree, therefore you must not understand. Clearly the problem is you, you must be un-enlightened, or somehow simply negative or lacking in humanity. You are not inclusive of all your fellow music lovers, you heartless b*****d."

I would suggest it falls in with many other PC values, which are "better" or "progressive". And the bodhran, I would suggest, is progressive, being relatively new to the music and hardly central to its roots and sound.

I have been playing the bodhran when encouraged to (and ONLY when encouraged to, be it session or performance) for over 25 years. Fortunately, I learned early on that, like sharing a meal, music can be a friendly MUTUAL experience which more than one person can enjoy. So, when sitting down to dine, I do not force steak upon a vegetarian. They neither want it nor need it, and they have their rights and tastes, too.

If there are really so many bodhranists with that kind of mind-set, perhaps the drum should be re-named the BOOR-ran.
I sincerely hope not.
:-/

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Your vegetarian analogy belies what you really think. OK, so you can respect a vegetarian’s right not to eat meat, and even happily sit down and enjoy a veggie meal with them. But really, you do think there is something lacking in their taste spectrum. And it’s right, vegetarians have, for what ever reason, limited their taste spectrum.

Here’s a better food analogy. Salt.

Playing tunes with a bodhran is like sitting down to a meal and someone smothering your plate with salt. The thing is, you can’t do without salt, of course, but all your food has more than enough salt already contained within it.

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Good one, Michael.

Last month I was comparing bodhran-infested sessions with beautiful late summer evenings in the Highlands. You have a fantastic view of the sea and Cuillin Ridge, no wind, a warm glow in the sky from the setting sun. Then the midges find you and make the whole thing bloody miserable. You try to bear it for a wee while but eventually give up and flee to the tent.

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Michael - I think your argument there belies your own prejudices. I’ve been mostly herbivourous for most of my adult life - not for any moral, ethical, spiritual, or health reasons, but initially for reasons of economy, as a student, and later on because I had simply lost the taste for meat.
Having spent a few years cooking vegetarian food, I began to find that meat is simply an annoying and overpowering flavor which drowns out everything interesting in a meal.

The bodhran analogy should be obvious: to the naive palatte the bodhran seems like an essential ingredient in a session, but if you do without it for a little while you start tasting everything really interesting in the tune, and you realize that what you were hearing before wasn’t the tunes at all - it was the bodhran.

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Are the pipes a mutton biriani with dei, onoin sald and a side of nihari, the flute a crab curry with special noodles, the fiddle in roast duck with rice and lashings of jasmin tea, a box my mum’s minced lamb in gravy with mashed potato and bottle of Buckie and bugle a bland rice pudding with no raspberry jam?

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Perhaps:
pipes- cardomom
flute- five spice
fiddle- fish sauce
box- bird’s eye chilli
bugle- metholated spirits

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I like the salt analogy They smother their own plate because that is what they are used to.

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Tee hee

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I like the Indian food analogy. It elevates this whole discussion.

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I like Indian food. It’s tasty.
(and it usually doesn’t have any bodhran in it)

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"meat is simply an annoying and overpowering flavor which drowns out everything interesting in a meal"

Only if you’re a crap cook.

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Meat is not necessary for some people, nor is it, like certain percussion instruments, merely a matter of proper presentation.

Nor is added salt necessary, if your diet already indirectly includes enough of it through the right ingredients.

And Michael, with all due respect, I fail to see where I implied there is anything lacking in a vegetarian’s taste spectrum, (which by the way, sir, can be much broader than the spectrum of choices made by many who DO include animal products).

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Among other opinions represented above, here are two extreme positions represented:
1) People who love the bodhran because you can learn all you need to know in 10 minutes.
2) People who hate the bodhran because you can learn all you need to know in 10 minutes.
Both extremes reinforce each other because of that one central fallacy they share. The haters who state that you can learn everything about it in 10 minutes actually encourage those who want to jump in after 10 minutes, after all, they did say that was all that was required. And each side holds in common their belief that the person with the other position is an idiot. A self perpetuating circle of unhappiness ensues.
The bodhran is a musical instrument, a percussion instrument that you can do some amazing and varied things with. People like John Joe Kelly, Johnny McDonough, and here in New England, Mance Grady, all show that there are musical things you can do with it that take a heck of a lot longer than ten minutes to learn how to do. It is not capable of melody (although varying tones are possible), and it is a percussion instrument, but it is a musical instrument.
So, say you dislike it, or like it, but please, let go of this ridiculous notion that you can learn everything you need to know about it in 10 minutes.
I will climb off my soapbox now.

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3) people who, like you Al, believe there is much more to the bodhran than the 10 mins argument. You have just stated the defining characteristic of the pro bodhranista’s argument, ie that you invariably blame the drum’s bad reputation on the many bad practitioners of the thing.
4) people like me who are not in the slightest bit interested in the 10 mins argument but know that there is more than enough percussion in the tunes themselves.

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"And it’s right, vegetarians have, for what ever reason, limited their taste spectrum."

Am I right in thinking you are a smoker, Mr Gill?

If so, you’ve pretty well knackered your "taste spectrum" anyway.

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Ex-smoker. Stopped a long long time ago. Taste buds now much improved and my appreciation of them also much improved.

I was a vegetarian for a decade or so also, but decided that limiting any form of taste spectrum is counter productive to the enjoyment of life.

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Strange, I thought you were one of those who goes out for a smoke break at the session. Must have misread.

Anyway. If you think that your "taste spectrum" is adequate, you are possibly off the mark. Try some of these, starting with surströmming, which is veering towards the infrared of the "taste spectrum":
http://www.openjourney.com/article/18-stinky-foods-around-the-world-41.html

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I go out … when my mates go out … for their smoke.

I have never ever used the word adequate under any circumstance

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(apart from then)

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"I have never ever used the word adequate under any circumstance"

No, but you seemed to say that you ceased to be a vegetarian because it was limiting your "spectrum" - which would imply that you consider your "spectrum" to be no longer limited, therefore it is adequate - but if "limiting any form of taste spectrum is counter productive to the enjoyment of life", then a few fermented products like surströmming, kiviak or hákarl should be on your menu.

Enjoy.

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>> "[I found that] meat is simply an annoying and overpowering flavor which
>> drowns out everything interesting in a meal"

>> Only if you’re a crap cook.

Michael, this is exactly the bodhran players’ argument: the bodhran only kills the tunes if the player isn’t any good.

I typically agree with you, but I notice that you don’t seem to give a damn about arguing against yourself just to be contrary.

Anyway, I think we both have found that the bodhran is an instrument which is incompatible with the music, because it overpowers everything interesting that’s going on in the music. And you might not agree with this, but I think that players who like the bodhran have never heard good tunes played well, or if they have been in the room with them, they haven’t recognized them for what they are.
And for me, that’s the experience of trying to describe why I haven’t gone back to eating meat. If it doesn’t work for you, that’s fine: the point of the post was that your argument reveals your prejudices just as much as Piece’s does. And mine, of course, reveals my own.

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"…the more seasoned bodhran player."

Yum. I would assume that this is something like bacon, which I don’t consider to be meat, (along with good barbeque), and, of course, a well-seasoned bodhran player. Any one could be paired with roasted new potatoes, kale, and a nice, hoppy ale.

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Yes, the bodhran players’ argument is that the bodhran only kills the tunes if the player isn’t any good. And if you agree with this then the veggie analogy works.

But the veggie analogy doesn’t work because the bodhran does not add anything that is not already there, instead it masks it -hence the salt analogy.



Yes, I ceased to be a vegetarian because it was limiting my spectrum. And now my spectrum is less limited. But one’s spectrum will always be limited by the things one has not yet tried. So I’ll try anything.

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I’ve only been in sessions with competent bodhran players.
I’ve never had a problem with this instrument in a session
or performance situation. Occasionally the thumping has seemed loud, but every instrument should get its chance to be in the spotlight from time to time.
Once or twice I asked for a mini-lesson during a session from a decent player. I was not able to learn how to play it in 10 minutes. I still don’t know how to play it. I’m guessing it would take a significant time commitment to learn to play it to the level of the others that I’ve heard. I don’t have that kind of time right now. The most amusing thing about bodhrans to me is the reaction they generate on this discussion board, and the many ways that people pronounce this word.

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"But the veggie analogy doesn’t work because the bodhran does not add anything that is not already there, instead it masks it -hence the salt analogy.

# Posted on September 15th 2011 by llig leahcim "

The veggie analogy does work, sir. But it works for making my point, not yours.

And, to be accurate, the bodhran all-too-frequently DOES add something that is not already there -
it adds a thumping, rhythmic, over-bearing sound or flavor or quality which I do not care for in all things ITM.

So would a boot heel on the pubroom floor.

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"But one’s spectrum will always be limited by the things one has not yet tried. So I’ll try anything."

And what if you don’t like it?

Re: Bodhran wanted

"So, say you dislike it, or like it, but please, let go of this ridiculous notion that you can learn everything you need to know about it in 10 minutes."

Al - I said it before, but 10 minutes is only an exaggeration. Everything you need to know about playing the bodhran is learned in almost no time. The guys that you mention are mostly about filling in the dull moments in a live show, not about actually playing music. They can play bodhran solos, yes. If you want a bodhran solo, they’re your guys. But if you want a bodhran solo, you’re not talking about playing music, you’re talking about masturbation from start to finish. Nothing wrong with masturbation, of course, I’m told even George Washington was known to indulge, but I’d rather it were not part of my session, and I certainly don’t want to watch it on stage.

There is nothing those guys can teach you that will save the bodhran from itself: for sessions, it’s useless, always will be, and bringing a bodhran to a session is like wearing a "Tosser" badge. For your seven piece Bothy-style megaband, you can have a tosser on the stage with you if you like - it’ll give you a chance to get off the stage for ten minutes if you need a fag or a shag - but at a session it’s nothing but a mess.

It’s not about whether you can learn it in ten minutes or twenty, it’s about what you can do with it, and what you can’t. What you can do with it is convince morons that you play Irish music. What you can’t do with it is play Irish music.

Clear now? Good.

Re: Bodhran wanted

"every instrument should get its chance to be in the spotlight from time to time"

Why? And what kind of a session has spotlights, anyway?

Re: Bodhran wanted

"the many ways that people pronounce this word"
The word is easy to pronounce. Say it like this TAM-BOOR-EEN-WITH NO JING-OOLS-AND-A-SHADE-EE-HIS-TOOR-EE.

Re: Bodhran wanted

Someone get that man an internet.

Re: Bodhran wanted

The wrist action is certainly similar, Jon.

Re: Bodhran wanted

Jon,
I note you wrote:

"But if you want a bodhran solo, you’re not talking about playing music, you’re talking about masturbation from start to finish. Nothing wrong with masturbation, of course, I’m told even George Washington was known to indulge, but I’d rather it were not part of my session, and I certainly don’t want to watch it on stage. "

That, sir, is slander of the lowest order,
and I do strongly take offense.

George Washington NEVER played the bodhran.
;-)

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Re: Bodhran wanted

Good one, Piece!
(As for continuing the argument regarding the musicality of bodhrans, I rest my case, noting from previous discussions that certain positions on this board are set in stone.)

Re: Bodhran wanted

We hold these truths to be self-evident…

Re: Bodhran wanted

The offense rests.

Now, what is all this I keep hearing
about session etiquette?
:-)

Posted by .

Re: Bodhran wanted

I do hope that Beltane got the information he was seeking…

Well said, Al Brown. Except, the position of one contributor isn’t set in stone at all. I’m referring to Jon Kiparsky, sole occupant of Arse Island and an arse of such magnitude that his name even has the syllable “arse” in it! I’m afraid he’s a musical schizophrenic. I mean, look at some of his tragically confused posts about the bodhran from JUST ONE THREAD!

“I play the thing”. “I like the thing”. “I’d play a gig on the bodhran again without hesitation, if the money was right”. “I’ve played a lot of bodhran, and I’ve made a lot of money playing the bodhran”. “I think they’re fine in a pub band”. “I like the bodhran just fine”. “In a session, it’s irrelevant at best and an obstruction at worst”. “I just don’t like the playing of the bodhran. It’s a wretched misery, it’s a cry for help, it’s a sickness and an affliction”. “I have never yet found anyone who actually wants to hear it in a session”. “In a session, in a bar, when you have half a dozen people playing actual instruments, there’s no room for the bodhran”. “as rude as sitting down and banging on a drum while people are trying to play music together”. “Just leave the damned drum at home and I’ll be happy as a pope in a haberdasher’s”.

Now he’s comparing it to wearing a "Tosser" badge! I’d feel a lot more insulted if someone said to me "Hey aren’t you Jon Kiparsky" than if they said "Hey, aren’t you a bodhran player". As a matter of fact, I think the World Tosser Championship was won when one competitor pipped another through his clever wearing of an "I am Jon Kiparsky" badge, thereby rendering the judges’ decision a foregone conclusion.

The moment anyone opens a thread with the word "bodhran" anywhere in the vicinity, he whips out his copy of "1001 tired, stupid, spineless, facile, moronic comments about bodhrans" and gets stuck right in. You might agree that his opinion ain’t worth squat, at least until such time as he makes up his mind. And even then, probably not.
m.d.

Re: Bodhran wanted

I didn’t used to 100% agree with Jon, but the past five or six years of putting up with all manner of awful bodhran playing in sessions, with scary regularity, have conditioned me to dislike the things passionately. The only thing they add to a session, generally speaking, is aggravation.

A small handful of the ones I’ve met are fine — they can play, they’re good banter, and I enjoy having tunes with those guys — but these are by no means are the majority and when someone unknown walks into your session with a bodhran, there is a 98% chance they will be awful.

There is little horse stabled next to mine who has, throughout much of her life, been shown there are very few reasons to like people. Not every person she has encountered has treated her badly or ignorantly, but she has reasons to assume guilty until proven innocent and consequently will put her ears flat back and try to bite you if you walk past her stall door. I feel like that horse when I’m in a session with bodhrans.

Re: Bodhran wanted

Hey emmdee, are you one of the good bodhran players then?

Posted .

Re: Bodhran wanted

emmdee, you must be a bofhran player. Not because you’re defending it, but because you haven’t managed to actually read any of those posts you’re so proud of having found.

So we’ll put this very simply: I like the bodhran fine, unless you bring it to a session. Now, go back and see if you can find anything that isn’t consistent with that.
Don’t bother, you can’t.

Two things have changed over time: I’ve become firmer in that opinion and I’ve lost patience for the putrid mewling of the defenders of the drum. But allowing for that, you’ll notice that what I don’t like is not the drum itself, but the practice of bringing it to a session and imposing your bippity-boppity on people who have then got the choice to either suffer through it or be as rude as only llig seems to be able to manage.

As I say - and there’s no great revelation here - I enjoy playing the bodhran, and I’ve done a lot of it, and I think people should play all the bodhran they like - somewhere else. And yes, if you offered me a reasonable price for it, I’d turn up to a gig and play bodhran all night, as long as the musicians were good. Why not? It’s the easiest money you can make, really.

Just keep it out of the session, and I’m happy as a bull in a china shop. As I’ve said before.

Re: Bodhran wanted

"as rude as only llig seems to be able to manage"?

Ha, you’ve obviously never met my mates I play with.

Posted .

Re: Bodhran wanted

"the past five or six years of putting up with all manner of awful bodhran playing in sessions, with scary regularity, have conditioned me to dislike the things passionately."

Couldn’t have put it better. The distaste for bodhran playing seems to be a function of one’s experience as a musician, and mostly of one’s experience listening to bodhran players.

That really should tell you something, emmdee.

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@lllig - Maybe I’ll get a chance some time. That kind of "rude", I think I could get along with.

Re: Bodhran wanted

@Weejie:

I’ve had surstromming. I followed native advice, which was to eat it in one or more bread rolls with generous amounts of raw onion included and washed down with plenty of aquavit. It was revolting stuff, but still seems more manageable than the rest of the items on that list, most of which seem quite unspeakable…

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"I’ve had surstromming."

Now there’s a man with a robust spectrum.

Re: Bodhran wanted

Jon, Don’t hold back, tell us how you really feel.
Signed,
A Putrid Mewler ;-)

Re: Bodhran wanted

Oh, Al, if you want to be a defender of the drum, you’re going to have to show a little more commitment than "they’re not that bad".
You’re not a putrid mewler - you’re just a liberal. "Some of my best friends are bodhran players", that sort of thing. :)

Re: Bodhran wanted

There we are, then!
m.d.