Session etiquette?

Session etiquette?

Hey all,

Since I don’t play sessions very often, I was wondering if there are some general rules that I should go by or any pointers, etc. when playing in sessions.

When I do play, I try to hang back and be very respectful of the other players. One thing I already know is that most people HATE noodling, so I am sure to never do that! I consider myself a good patron when it comes to sessions, but I’d like to hear some other comments!

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-Don’t start two sets in a row. You probably don’t do this by instinct anyway, but just making sure

-Play Irish session tunes. Before they were run off, there was someone in my session who would play for twenty minutes solo on the latest scottish compositions. needless to say, we made sublte but rather loud and conspicuous hints for her to clear out.

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Oh, that reminds me…I played at a session where they played some Scottish tunes! Is that common?

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Session etiquette is very simple: don’t interfere with the flow of the music at the session you’re visiting — watch and learn. Don’t assume anything and use good manners and common sense when asking to join in. And remember that every session you go to will be different than the one you were at before.

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"I played at a session where they played some Scottish tunes! Is that common?" - Aye, very common ….especially in Scotland! ;-)

It is all a question of manners really, Irishfiddler.

But here are a couple of don’ts you might want to remember:

Don’t Fart!
&
Don’t ‘throw up’ in anyone else’s pint glass but your own!

But seriously, yes, we have discussed this subject before & here are a few old threads you might want to investigate:

Can *Too* much session etiquette be detrimental?:
https://thesession.org/discussions/7902/comments#comment169373

Session Do’s and Don’ts:
https://thesession.org/discussions/7675/comments#comment164738

Playing in sessions:
https://thesession.org/discussions/728/comments#comment10533

HELP SESSION ETIQUETTE AND RULE BOOK:
https://thesession.org/discussions/2920/comments#comment57997

Session etiquette: what to do when a guitar-player just won’t keep quiet?:
https://thesession.org/discussions/339/comments#comment4764

Field Guide To The Irish Music Session:
https://thesession.org/discussions/295/comments#comment3986

Guidelines for The Session. Please read.:
https://thesession.org/discussions/1263/comments#comment20289

A point of etiquette:
https://thesession.org/discussions/7792/comments#comment167443

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Ha! I like where someone said "Get in, sit down, shut up, and hang on!" That’s great! Thanks for the links, I dunno why I didn’t think to search for that.

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"Don’t start two sets in a row"

What’s wrong with starting 2 sets in a row?

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Also, is it weird to have a singer at a session? The only reason I would think so, would be because he would cause the session "music" to stop. It seems a little bit like something you wouldn’t really do. Am I right?

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"What’s wrong with starting 2 sets in a row?" Unless you’re anchoring, hosting, leading or whatever you want to call it — it’s bad form. If you’re asked to, fine, but if you just started or suggested one set and right away launch into another – it comes across as being a bit self-indulgent… don’t you think?

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Who said anything about "launching right away into another"? If someone starts a set, and then there’s a break, people have a chat and a drink, and then the same person thinks of another set they’d like to play, they’re welcome to play, at least in the sessions I go to. Oh dear, looks like the sessions I go to don’t live up to the standards of the ultimate authority on Irish music - the one and only: "thesession.org discussion board" - hip hip, hooray.

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I agree with not starting two sets in a row. To me, it’s common sens. Some great players want to take their time to start something, not have someone in the back always trying to start their own tunes. Play your set, then allow other musicians to start one, or even ask them if they won’t.

Same thing in a conversation. If you’re talking with someone who is a little bit shy and won’t talk about himself/herself that much, is that a reason to only talk about yourself? I would rather ask that person ‘what about you?’ than just talk about myself. It applies to sessions, too.

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That analogy doesn’t work for me. Starting a tune isn’t like talking about yourself. You start a tune for the benefit of the group as a whole and everyone joins in. This isn’t about "you" or "me" or "control". I’d rather think of it as throwing in an idea. If one person is more on the ball or less tired than everyone else and has more ideas to throw in on one particular night then I’d say go for it.

What you describe is like an English "folk" session where you go round the circle and people take it in turns to start a tune.

Feck that. That’s not my idea of a good session. But hey, each to his/her own, eh?

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I am a novice session attendee, but it has been nice to be whispered what the tunes are and in what key (also any key changes) and being invited to lead plus play tunes I know as a solo. Sometimes I play invited solos while the accordions get drinks. I get along with tunes I dont know by playing chords and ends of phrases. It works, I am not dischordant and I have no inflated impressions about my ability.

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"Some great players want to take their time to start something, not have someone in the back always trying to start their own tunes"

Again, you’re turning this into an issue of starting sets too quickly before the last one finished, or "who’s a great player" and "who’s not". The issue at hand is whether you can start 2 sets in a row. And who said anything about "always" trying to start tunes? That’s called hogging a session. I’m saying that in my part of the world, there’s no law stating that you’re not allowed to start 2 sets in a row. If it’s against the law to play 2 sets in a row in your session, great, good luck to you with your silly snobby laws.

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Crank it up Dowser. For the record, i’ve never had a problem with you starting two sets in a row, aside from the fact that your sets always remind me of these fantastic tunes i’m yet to learn!!
Damn you!!!!

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Yeah and I would never have a problem with you starting 2 sets in a row either. Hey at least we have a new silly rule to try for Tuesday! If someone tries to start 2 sets in a row they must be glared at sternly and perhaps barked at by the "host/anchor/lead or whatever person". Can you imagine trying to do that here? "Excuse me, you’re not allowed. Put your instrument down at once, and wait 45 seconds until session member A235 starts a new set and then you may continue". Orwell’s "The Session". LOL.

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HEY! I just had a great idea. To stop people from starting sets too soon after the last one finished, we should get an egg timer and set it going after the end of a set, and make it so that if you want to start a set then you have to wait for the timer to finish otherwise you’re "out" and you have to buy a round of drinks.

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Shoot, I don’t know enough tunes to start two in a row. I have to spread mine out so I have something to play the rest of the time! haha…

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maybe there should be an egg timer for starting to soon and not being soon enough.

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Or one for limiting the amount of percussion? That could be a shakey egg timer.

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Matt Molloy said that a good session is a place were folk LISTEN to one another. Probably he means, listen to eachother while playing, listen to suggestions from musicans and audience, and probably be patient and listen to solo playing. Personally I love hearing solo playing (from others) if the musican is good, but I never play solo myself if not asked.
Why?, well solo playing more often introduces new tunes and you hear the players uses his/her own style wich is for me great inspiration.

I’ve seen the discussion about starting to set in a row, I think what it’s really about is not to take control, lead or own the session, let everybody have the opportunity to say their meaning (suggest tune etc.)

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What?!!? a good idea :)

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*Three* sets in a row!? Just the mere thought of it sends shivers down my spine. How dare you even suggest it?! That goes against everything this website stands for. I can hardly believe I’m even speaking to you. Just, get off my screen, you disgust me.

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Dow. What is fundamentally wrong with you? Seriously. Northumbria sessions must suck because of You Personally.

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That would be pretty amazing seeing as I live on the other side of the planet.

What’s fundamentally wrong with me is that I try to post on this discussion board despite the fact that I have a sense of humour.

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Just don’t post three in a row, that would be rudely real, I mean really rude.

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I

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agree

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with

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that

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Well I never !

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Bad form chaps.Form a hollow square,break the the strings on my fiddle,pour my Guinness into the dust and drum me out of the ranks of the sessioneers.

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Isn’t the main thing, like in any unfamiliar social situation, to just tkae a bit of time to suss out how the land lies, then take tentative steps towards intergrating? If you make a faux -pas, accept criticism and learn from it. Every session has its own ‘protocol’ according to the people it comprises.

I’ve noticed that, on the English traditional music scene, and in sessions in the more ‘English’ parts of England (which are often a mix of English, Irish, Scots and other music), what is accetped as normal conduct is quite different from that typical in a (nominally) ‘Irish’ session. I have been at a few sessions where everybody has played standing, rather than sitting; and it is apparently quite acceptable - mandatory, even - to jump in with a tune or song at the first opportunity (I was actually *told* to do this by a regular at one session I visited).

Firstly, I must stress that my experience of sessions outside either London or Ireland is very limited, and the above is not necessarily typical of English sessions. Secondly, thes session have their own code of conduct, which a visiting musician must do their best to follow. But one encounters the problem, not infrequently, in London sessions, where visiting musicians from out of town, accustomed to another type of session, fail to recognize the difference. Those who have never experienced sessions outside the Irish music scene often interpret their behaviour as plain arrogance - and as representative of the English.

I do not mean this to be a comment on English people - I am one myself - just on people who do not display behaviour appropriate to the situation. It’s like wolf-whistling at the opera, or wearing evening dress on a nudist beach. Neither do I mean to claim the higher ground in any way - I have made many, and continue to make mistakes of this kind, in all sorts of situations. I just try not to be Mr. Bean.

Hot tattie ~

1 potato

Hot tattie ~

2 potato

Hot tattie ~

3 potato or ~

Hot tattie ~

Yo spoon, but if it smells funny, with slight sulphuous overtones, and the guy running it talks in a kind of mechanical voice and has red glinty eyes and the general decor is early Mordur ~ get the hell out of there quick…avoiding those freaky dudes in the dirty black sheets…

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As a regular session visitor, I find myself starting sets and trying to get a feel of what their repertoire is. I do try and ask do you know this, do you know that (and by the same token, if you have arrived part way through the sesh - has anyone already played thus?).
But the rule of thumb should maybe be - judge how quick the regulars are at picking tunes up and if people join in, play the tune two or more times, if no one joins in (and it isn’t an easy tune or they are usually quick on the uptake), play it once and move on to another.
I do feel a bit of reticence starting two sets together, but if I leave enough gap for an opportunity for others, or ask - do you know this, they usually give you permission by saying - yes we know that.

p.s. they do play as much ITM as home-brewed in Scotland (Glasgie and Edinbro at least)

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It is good to see this old hot tattie being resurfaced and passed around again.

I think some distinction needs to be made here between long time attendees, the old regulars of a session, and come-from-awayers. The later shouldn’t start anything until they get a feel for the session, an understanding ~ and are asked, or ask… It is rude to just show up at a new session, someone else’s, and then jump in full bore… A nice open and sociable one will find a way to give you the shove forward anyway ~ into making your contibution… But if you are a regular, it may be be that you know well the usual sets and so what if you happen to start up more than one set in a row? I have also seen the other considerate way, where someone finds out what the newcomer plays, but that visitor is too shy to start it, so the regular start it up for them, or with them… There can’t be any harm there.

So, I think there is plenty of scope where starting two or more sets in a row isn’t out of the question. And just how do you treat it if a group do that, after having chatted about it and said ~ "let’s play so-and-so!" Allowing some natural evolution into the soup keeps the interest up. If things get too bound up in rules and regulations ~ well, I’ve been to that sort of Folk Club, and not just in England, and it was definitely a bit stilted, nice folks, but you knew who big brother or mamma was, and you daren’t step out of line. This sort of thing also comes up in concert, like with the Comhaltas tours… And it happens in dance. And those faces when you’ve stepped over the line ~ damned folks can look ugly when they want to… :-P

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I’ve been there in the past, knowing someone is too shy to start up a set but knowing their repertoire and their favourites and starting them up for them, and at a tempo considerate of their abilities…so they can join in easily and enjoy…

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Yes, I for one appreciate it when someone starts up a set full of tunes I know, even if it’s their third (*gasp*) start in a row.

I’m usually knackered by the time a session gets going, on account of actually have work to go to in the morning :-) , (do these young musicians never work?) and my brain is pretty bereft of ideas. Some kind soul who nudges me in the right direction by starting a tune they know I know is a welcome kick up the Jack C.

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How many tunes are there in a set? 3, sometimes 2, very occasionally 4, in most sessions I go to. But I’ve been told there are places where they’ll take just one tune and play it 6 or 7 times, exploring its many intricacies as they play.

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In response to the original question I’d offer the following so far as my experiences in Irish sessions in my part of the world has been:

people playing at sessions go there either to play their instrument in the manner they think it should be played, or to play Irish music. Try to be one of the latter.

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Re: Session etiquette? ~ what?!!?

Well, going back to the ‘beginning’, it sounds like you’ve got a good understanding and way with you already irishfiddler, more of your kin would be very welcome in most sessions… But I’d steer clear of ‘what?!!?’ for the time being, just until he gets bile free, maybe something to loosen things up for him is called for in the meantime, a good laxative… I think they still make them chocolate flavoured…

But I wouldn’t worry, what?!!? doesn’t know 15 obscure tunes… He just a regular sort of guy, all the standards… ;-)

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Yer just being silly. You may not be silly more than twice per discussion.

I agree with Clifardo and Phantom. We had this visitor from Ireland who totally hi-jacked our session for 3 months. Most of the time he was playing solo, and sometimes just the guitar player and bodhran player playing along with him. He did not notice everybody else sitting there seething. He took no notice of what tunes we did or didn’t know. He started most of the sets, and the ones he didn’t start, he hi-jacked by forcing the tempo and style to what he wanted. He played faster than he could, and his rhythm was exceptionally erratic.

This guy had no idea. He thought he was the bee’s knees, and we were just to happy to have a real Irishman here to show us how it’s done. He believed that he was using very good manners. He thought he was following session etiquette. Maybe he just never really considered the possibility that anybody else’s session may be different to his, and since he never bothers to find out what others want, he never will. He’d been to many different sessions before, and I’m quite sure he was equally oblivious there too.

No amount of friendly suggestion, subtle and less subtle hints could get through to him. All that was left was to become nasty, and none of us wanted to be the a&$ehole that tells him bluntly to get out of our session, because we are usually such a friendly bunch who welcome visitors. So we just waited for him to leave.

But I digress. My actual point is that you do not know whether your good manners are considered good manners elsewhere or not. You can quite happily think that you are doing fine, but in reality they are just waiting for you to leave. By being more restrained than you normally would be, like not starting two sets in a row, you have less chance of spoiling other’s fun.

How do you know just how restrained to be? Well, you don’t, it’s a bit of a guess. You pick a few numbers, like "no more than two" or "only one per evening" or "no more that 7 bodhrans per session", and you use these as your guidelines. You set your numbers low to start off with, and once you know how that particular session works, you adjust them. When a newcomer asks for some general rules in a session, you share these guidelines of yours. That does not imply that nobody at the session is ever allowed to break these "laws" or face the wrath of the session police. If you really believe that then… well, I am only allowed to use that word once per post. ;-)

When I started, I also asked the etiquette question. I received many such "rules", and although there are many I do not follow any more, I am very glad I did in the beginning. And each time I go to an unfamiliar session, I’ll follow those rules again.

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Damn, he must have got out. I’ll have to call around and see if they can get him back behind bars. Sorry Shrog. I’m just sad because we thought we’d been rid of him for good, though we wouldn’t wish him on anyone else. Even sader, I’ve been in the position of being elected asshole. Have ‘c’ do it, he doesn’t mind. Actually guys, I hate being there…but sometimes you just need someone to do it and 3 months with what you’ve outlined is a hell no one should have to suffer.

Again, I think it is up to the session and its regulars to set the tone, and if someone shows up that screws things up ~ to inform their ignorance as to what your session is about. I know, you shouldn’t have to do that, but damned, some folks are thick… So, have a basic seed of what it is you want from your session, you folks who are regulars and who make these sessions happen repeatedly. Talk it out occassionally, as we’re doing here. This is an important one to keep airing, so we all get some idea how ‘others’ operate, what they expect, so we can be respectful and on our guard with consideration when visiting sessions other than those we frequent. Hell, it isn’t just each place that is different, but the animal can be damned moody too, so from week to week things can differ. It helps to be considerate and adaptive and observant…especially when we’re just visiting, or just arriving for the first time ~ and stay that way for a few times more until you get to know folks and have some idea of the way of things. You may just find it isn’t for you and you need to move on, or start your own party…

Let’s take this person you’ve just outlined here Shrog, our ‘friend’ ~ I know them, they are on this site, but I bet you they don’t realize it’s them we’re talking about. That’s the problem with ignorance, it can’t see the nose in front of it, and too often it’s convinced it’s sh*t don’t stink… ;-)

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Irishfiddler, I just checked what?!!?’s tunebook, all pretty much regular stuff, but the balance is a worry:

1% hornpipes / 18% jigs / 81% reels ~ and nothing else… So no worry there…

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Actually, our "friend" got kicked off of this site as well.

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Shrog, that’s terrible. That guy sounds like an arsehole. But look at what you’ve written:

!) He hijacked the session and played solo
2) He didn’t notice other people were angry with him
3) He took no notice of the tunes other people did or didn’t know
4) He started most of the sets
5) He forced the tempo and style
6) His rhythm was erratic
7) He thought he was the bee’s knees
8) He wanted to show everyone how it was done
9) He didn’t consider that other sessions could be different to his
10) He never bothered to find out what others wanted
11) No amount of friendly suggestion could get through to him

That’s rather more than simply starting two sets in a row.

Is that why you think you have to have rules? So that people like this can be stopped?

I think you can start two sets in a row and still be well-mannered and sensitive.

I’m afraid I don’t see much of a connection with what you wrote and the issue at hand.

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Like I said earlier - I think it is all a question of manners really.

I run a couple of sessions but usually prefer to let others start the sets of tunes - well, I’ve heard all my tunes before & would far rather hear someone else’s, especially if they are a visitor to the session.

Getting to 3 sessions each week means I get plenty of chance to play, so I’m quite happy to take a back seat in the ‘starting dept.’.

If a player has loads of great tunes & sets, then I say let him or her tear away & let the session flow. That’s the trick really, to get that beastie flowing! I’ve been to far too many ‘organised’ sessions, run by CCE, which had a dreaded MC & which were more painfull than having teeth extracted without ye olde jab! There’s usually always plenty of time for others to jump in if they want, as long as that player is playing tunes that others know!

I have seen the ignorant, session killer, which sees someone play set after set of obscure tune & play each one four or five times & in the end just bore the pants off everyone!

One local Piano Accordion player’s speciality is to play 12/13 reels on the trot, full tilt! …… OK, if you get tired, just stop for a rest & a drink & then join in again, when you get your breath back!

I don’t really think it is on to have hard & fast rules on this one, for the wonderful, wonderful thing is that ‘every session is different’ & what is it the French say ‘Viva La Difference’!

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Well Dow, I also wrote that this guy had no clue that he was being rude. This guy, just like you, believed that the number of sets he was starting was still within acceptable limits. The "rules" as you like to call them are there to help the clueless get a clue.

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Ok, to answer the the original question:

There are no rules in sessions, but if you don’t want people to think you’re an arsehole, avoid doing those eleven points that Dow summarised for us.

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I was messing around this morning with that news feed thing mentioned in an earlier post (RSS) and just got a pop-up window to tell me simultaneously about the two items "Dealing with session etiquette pressure" and "large asteroid zips past earth" - puts it all into perspective really, doesn’t it!

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On some nights, everyone sits around, asking other folks what we should play, and no one comes up with any thing, or comes up with one tune instead of a set. Lots of meandering. There are times when I would give my right arm (well, maybe my right leg since without my right arm, I wouldn’t be able to play) for someone to come along and start off two or three strong sets.
It is all about balance, sometimes you need more leadership, sometimes ou need less.
And even though it is harder than remaining silent, it is always better to speak the unpleasant truth and get it in the open. Shrog’s session hijacker was enabled the silence of those around him.

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Balance ~ yes, and those ‘regulars’ who have been supporting their session have some idea of what makes their session work and flow, and rarely have I been anywhere, at least in Eire, where it was one person at a time in a kind of leapfrog fashion, or like taking a numbered ticket at the deli counter. Number 56, it’s your tune to pick a set for us. Hey, number 56, does anyone have number 56? Damn, I guess he’s left. Is there a number 57, 58, 59, 60??? 61? O.K. 61 ~ no, sorry 61, we’ve completely exhausted our selection of Rheinlanders. 62, is there a 62?

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We were not silent. We asked him politly to give the regular session players a chance to play what they enjoy and to not hog the session so much. So he stepped down as king of all sessions to session leader. And he did so quite willingly and appologetically. He wasn’t so much an arsehole as just oblivious to what he was doing to our session.

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LOL @ this snobbery about two sets in a row.

Goodness me, going to sessions like this must be like stepping into a minefield. I’m guessing some rules have to take priority over others, so you get scenarios like this:

————————

"Go on there Dave, give us a tune"

"I can’t. I started the last set. According to clause 2.12 of the 1997 regulations based on the Universal Session.org Act, it’s not permissible for me to start another one"

"Oh well, Judith then, go on there, give us a tune"

"I am unable to do so. Only 3 minutes 24 seconds have elapsed since the end of the last set, it being the final "G" chord of the Reel Of Rio, actually 3 minutes 28 now, 29, 30…"

"Yeah alright that’s enough Judith. Okay let’s wait till the 3 minutes 55 seconds have passed.



…okay John. We can have another tune now. Go on there, give us a tune"

"I may not".

"But you started the last set so it wouldn’t be consecutive. You’re safe on the 2.12, surely?"

"Ah, but didn’t you read the small print on the same page (page 32, I believe)? I play piano accordion, as you can see - I am resting one on my lap. It was agreed at last month’s committee meeting that, because piano accordions were offensive to some members of the session, the playing thereof would be limited to one tune in every 11. I played 8 tunes ago".

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Open your ears Dow and grow up.

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Okay here’s my serious face :-|

What do you want to talk about, super annuation? I’m all ears!

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And here’s mine :c3

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It’s Homer Simpson! Haha I love it!

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I think Jeremys back………..

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Heres mine :-+

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Last night, I in a bar where there was a band playing. Ok, it was Jazz, Blues, Rock, Irish… mixed. This goes for trad sessions also. When outside abiding the laws of the smoking ban, a girl said to me

"Live Bands should replace discos"

Good point. When listening to live music, you mix and mingle with people. For example, you may go to a person and say "God that band /musician(s) are very good", and after you meet that person again and get to know the person. Where as in discos you dance and dance and thats it, a weeks work out. Also it is giving musicians.. and that speaks for all… a chance to become renowned for their talent and skills.

Ok. im a bit off point to the subject of the thread.

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No, it’s a bunny rabbit - you supply the ears.

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get the drinks in

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Mine’s a pint of porter and a shot of Crested Ten…

So, what’s the next set going to be? Ptarm, get off your ass, you’re always hanging around and not starting anything ;-) ~ so start something already…

Thank’s Ptarm, that’s better, I was getting fed up with reel after reel after reel of the same ol’ stuff…

What’s up Shrog, you been out pulling brambles or something all day and the heat’s gotten to yuh? Stop picking on Dow and Sarfly ~ or risk suffering their wrath…

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I got in on this discussion a bit late. You mean youz guys actually can start a set? Our little session has the same tunes and the same two people who start all the medleys. It’s great if you want to learn their 40 or so tunes but a bit restricting…

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(Open, unpaid) pub sessions are a community, and the same rules apply as would in other communities. ‘Be considerate’ is definitely the top rule, but another one could be: ‘Be tolerant’.

I’ve been to sessions where people are being very selfish, and a discreet word to them is in order. However, being quick to impose the ‘rule of law’ is also a kind of selfishness, especially if it is done without some kind of consensus feeling within the group. What that does is impose one’s own rigid expectations of what a session is ‘supposed to be’ on others.

I’ve played in very traditional sessions. I’ve also been to some pretty open non-traditional and way-cool sessions in a number of countries. My opinion (and it is only my opinion) is that the relaxed and experimental sessions are by far the most interesting (to players and audience) and friendly. Typically these sessions have lacked a dominant personality who imposes themselves upon the others (either by hogging the session or policing it).

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Get your meds, I like you under the influence what?!!? Hey, apologies, I lied in the stats, you had 2% hornpipes…

There does seem one issue overlooked, or not quite fingered ~ that there are all kinds of sessions run by all sorts of people, some have their Commandments, some I’ve stumbled across actually have them written down and bullet pointed. Some sessions are run by a ‘personality’, and like with any little kingdom, you have benign leaders and dictators ~ oh yeah, and the stuff in between, like things run by a committee. Some sessions really just aren’t open to new comers at all, zero, no thanks… I’ve stumbled into a few of these and you just have to go with what you find, in this case sitting on the sidelines listening.

Someone said already that no two sessions are alike, and did the French thing about blessing the differences. I wouldn’t go that far. Some do not have my blessings, but if you find something that disagrees with you, well, you don’t force your way into it ~ as that won’t work, just leave it and keep looking ~ or start your own session. If you’ve got a good idea it will soon attract like minded folk, and as usual ~ some not so agreeable characters are just about inevitable, remembering the earlier tale of woe.

If you do get to starting something up yourself, it always helps to have a few supportive friends behind the idea, to start it off, to think it out and come to some kind of decisions, like whether or not you feel the need to have bylaws and a seating arrangement…

You need to take your meds more regularly what?!!? ~ and I shouldn’t be winding up the mentally ill… ;-)

Re: Session etiquette?

I ain’t pickin’ on nobody. I just didn’t feel like repeating myself.

Irishfiddler asked for some pointers. Some people answered the question and others objected to the answers. I noticed that the people who objected to the answers were the ones using words like rules, law, commandments, rigid, authority, etc. Nobody who just answered the question used any of these words. So I objected to the objections.

I explicitly said, in so many words, that that is not what was meant, but that fell on deaf ears and that is why I made the bunny ears joke. I don’t think anybody got that though.

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Re: Session etiquette? ~ and alternate uses for wine ~

" ~ cooling down after watering the vege with a glass of wine ~ " ??? ~ Weird?!!?

Hey Shrog, bunnies ain’t deaf, even in the throws of mixamatosis… And by the way, if not evident, I thought you example of a ‘take-over’ and the discussion generated around that was useful. I definitely felt empathy there. Sorry if any ribbing / slagging was misinterpreted. I’m taking my meds now, a nice dark chilled rose, mmm, mmm… But there’s no way in hell I’m feeding the plants with it, before or after…though peas and beans like pee, just don’t get it on the leaves what?!!?… :-)

Re: Session etiquette?

‘c’, bunnies are definitely deaf if you chop their lugs off.

Sorry about yesterday Shrog. I was so immature back then. I think I managed to grow up a little during my sleep. I’m sure I’ll be able to listen very carefully to anything you have to say and take it on board. I think I will be able to answer the question in a much more mature way. What was the question again? Oh yes, whether there are any general rules that irishfiddler should go by. Hmmm…

Re: Session etiquette?

Gosh, I don’t know what to say, I wasn’t expecting any appologies, considering that I was the meanest person on this thread. I’m all embarrassed now. Maybe I came across grumpier than I meant to.

The bunny thing seemed funnier yesterday than it does today. I said "open your ears.." and then Dow said "I’m all ears" so I drew a bunny with no ears and Dow was supposed to say "what’s that supposed to be?" and then I was going to say "Why, it’s a bunny of course, you supply the ears."

I’ll just get my coat.

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Re: Session etiquette?

And I spoilt it all by saying it looked like Homer Simpson. Sorry! Well it does, sort of, like a 3D diagonal view of his head if you imagine his top lip sticking out. Never mind :-)

Re: Session etiquette?

Dow, the ‘starting 2 sets in a row’ comments, way back at the beginning of this thread, weren’t about hard and fast rules — they were about manners. If you want to turn them into comments about rules so you can knock them down… fine — have fun… but you missed the point entirely. If you think starting multiple sets in your session is acceptable – that’s great. It’s really up to you and your mates as to whether that’s good or bad manners. But I think if you showed up at someone else’s session and started carrying on that way it might not come off quite the way you would hope. The idea is to share the music and give others a chance to start tunes they enjoy too. That has nothing to do with rules, but it has everything to do with manners.

Re: Session etiquette?

No, sorry Dow, they just become omnidirectional if you chop their lugs off ~ and paranoid since they don’t know where the mower’s coming from anymore, or the bailer for that matter…

No, don’t go Shrog ~ what would it all be without you? It’s just a shame your drawing couldn’t be posted. I’d have loved to see a picture of an earless Dow and someone with a blindfold on trying to pin rabbit ears on him, imagining the drop in more ways than one that would turn it into pin the tale on the ~… I’ll leave the rest to our most active imaginations…

I don’t know if other people were taking you ‘literally’ in a kind of COMMANDMENTS from on high sort of way, but I wasn’t button, but I liked the way folks ran with it. I also like the general move of the subject toward ‘manners’ and ‘respect’ and ‘consideration’ toward others, rather than a Code of Practice inscribed on stone. ‘Flow’ is about being relaxed and at ease and that is more easily accomplished in a situation that has established norms, but is open and adaptive. (to a point ~ the above mentioned 3 month hijack being a move too far…)

I’m more like Ptarm, when I did attend sessions of any sort regularly. I tended to go with the flow instead of contributing to it. There’s bad there too, as I found I was losing some of the repertoire I’d built up elsewhere, but that was nobody else’s fault but my own. Once in a rare while, if it was too top heavy with reels, I’d offer up a mosel of change. More often than not I was observant, and if I saw someone sitting aside and not participating I’d try to make an opening for them.

That’s me trying to follow that old maxime to "do unto others as you would have them do unto you"… I have always liked that ‘Golden Rule’…which predates Christianity by several thousand years…so no one faith has a monopoly on it, and having been around so long and adopted by so many in a ton of different languages and beliefs, it must have some magic that insures its persistence. Anyway, when I was successful in making such openings ~ I was chuffed. It definitely felt good not to be worrying about my own space and making room for someone else…and trying to be aware of others in that way…

Damn, I can’t shake that image of Dow / Mark with bunny ears sticking through his baseball cap and his whiskers and his nose wiggling and ~ No! Brere Rabbit? So who’s the Tar Baby?

Damn fingers, i missed the ‘r’ ~ ‘mosel’ should have read ‘morsel’ (as you can imagine - mazurkas, barndances, flings and the like, or just a bit of something relaxed and 3/4 on our instruments…)

Re: Session etiquette?

Is it more offensive to play two three-tune sets in a row than to play one 17-tune mega-set?

Re: Session etiquette?

Yes.

I hate those "two three-tune sets in a row"-playing bahlstahls.

;-)

Re: Session etiquette?

Mr Phantom Button, you are quite correct. I would not go to another session and start 2 sets in a row unless I was asked. My point was that it shouldn’t be a hard & fast rule that people should feel that they *have* to adhere to. I started 2 sets in a row tonight and nobody moaned. It’s all about context and sensitivity, not about rules, which was the implication here. Remember? Irishfiddler asked for some "general rules to go by" and you supplied them. Well, I’m saying this "rule" should be explained more clearly and not taken to be all-encompassing. C’mon Phantom, d’ye wanna fight? We haven’t had proper fight in ages. Maybe we should have it somewhere else than this thread though…

Re: Session etiquette?

What a waste of time, remind me to not read more than one thread in a row on this site…

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Re: Session etiquette?

Don’t forget not to read more than one thread in a row on this site.

Re: Session etiquette?

Thanks for the reminder … I feel better now.

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Re: Session etiquette?

Don’t forget, mind.

Re: Session etiquette?

Hey Shrog, if you are still reading this, sorry for assuming that you suffered the transgressions of the session-wrecker in silence, glad you spoke up, and that it moved things in the right direction!

Re: Session etiquette?

Yeah, I hate that thing about placing the two forks together…

Re: Session etiquette?

Lovely salt cellars… Did you have these especially made? Hey Queenie, look at that prat over there sticking his pinky out as he drinks his tea, I mean, how daft can you get?

Re: Session etiquette?

it s really hard to find a decent session nowadays.
lots of stuck up musicians around.