mandolin / volume/ a problem/ a fix

I’m a frustrated mandolin player . . why because and I’ve heard this said hundreds of times on this site, that it can’t be heard “that” well in a session.

Well why can’t somebody out there, (there must be someone with a degree in electronics/acoustics) invent a “battery” operated pickup with a built in speaker which mandolin players can fit inside to make their mando just sound that “bit”, (don’t mean Jimi Hendrix ) louder in a session so you can be heard above the fiddles/whistles and accordians.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m totally against the idea of plug in amplified music in a session, but , anyway daft idea or what?

Oh by the way its my original idea . . . so patent pending . . . just joking . . possibly. Stewart. 5/1/ 05

It has been suggested to me on several occasions that I should get a small amp to use in sessions. This might be appropriate for, say, a bluegrass session, where a mandolin player takes breaks and needs to be heard above all the other instruments. But I find that the idea jars with my concept of a session. I enjoy the natural blend of my mandolin with the instruments around me. Yes, it is sometimes frustrating not to be able to hear oneself, but this is just part and parcel of being a mandolin player in traditional music - much as getting a dribble patch right in the crotch is part of being a whistle player and occasionally being sued for poking someone’s eye out is part of being a fiddler.

Above all, my priority in a session is what it sounds like to me and the musicians either side of me, not what it sounds like to the man talking at the bar.

…and it makes no difference whether the amp is inside or outside the mandolin.

Play facing the wall so the sound bounces back at you.

I have a small amp for my mandolin but I wouldn’t dream of bringing it into a session. It would be bad form, in my opinion. However, I’ve known players of other instruments who aren’t always as considerate.

Once again, I should say that the mandolin is a lot louder in a session than you think and the volume can be increased by adjusting your picking style. A good mandolin has a better projection. Also, do you want it to be “cutting through” all the time? It sounds nicer if it’s just part of the mix.
Having said that, I’ve heard really good players leading tunes on the mandolin and they can project the souns really well. So, much has to do with the style and/or experience of the player.

You could try getting more ‘attack’ and a bit more volume by playing closer to the bridge.

My main “bug bear” with playing mandolin in sessions is that, by “attacking” it more aggressively than I would normally do, the tuning is affected to a greater or lesser extent. So, I tend to have to “tweak” it quite a lot during sessions.
I never have this problem with the fiddle or other instruments and the mandolin is ok in “quieter” situations.

Yes that was something that used to irritate me too. It always seemed to be my A course that would go for some reason.

In 1970, I bought a Levin mandolin, the loudest one I ever heard and a beautiful tone, I played it for 27 years until one night I fell on it before a gig, with not a drop in me. I have heard several quite loud instruments in my time, in Ireland there were 3 or 4 players who used a guitar shaped flatback (the original Portuguese shape) with more often than not a picture of a lady in trad dance costume on the back, these were good playing mandolins and could always be heard in a session. I really think it’s a question of looking around instead of paying for something that might look nice and sound good amplified,
spend a little more time in the search, they must still be around somewhere. I have had to give up the instrument because of Arthrhitis but still have a one-off Italian made monster with an odd shape which plays loudly unamplified.
I also found that attacking the instrument like some fiddlers
helped to increase the volume, don’t rest the hand or fingers on the wood is another tip, use slightly heavier gauge strings than normal, if there is not one already there, put a fret immediately after the nut, this brightens the tone, make sure the grooves in the nut and bridge are perfectly cut, no vibrations. Hope this all helps?

Yup - always the A.

Yer man needs to make the entire device fit inside the body of the mandolin and output through a speaker on the underside of the body where its out of sight, then just don’t draw attention to the thing by having a big switch in full view, or a sticker calling it the “Acme Amplified Mandolin”.

I got a loud mandolin - problem solved. But when Stew tried one he didn’t like the sound, so I’ll just sit here and look smug then.

;o)

Try to find a resonator mandolin, like a National. They’re much louder than a regular mandolin. If that solution is too extreme, get a carved top mandolin with f holes. If it tends to be on the loud side, it should project pretty well. Personally, I would never spend much money on a mandolin that was only loud, but lacked in tone.

Experiment with these:

1. Do not let the mando rest against you or clothing. You can anchor it against you with only the edge of the binding on the bridge end. This can double your volume.

2. Play medium guage strings and raise the action a little then strike it a little harder. This will give you higher amplitude without the buzz.
3. Use thicker picks to strike harder in less time.

4. Spend more than $800 on a carved top mando and stay away from the “celtic” or “frying pan” models.

Maybe you could play some slow airs with one other instrument. I find the mandolin does its best when it is joined by another melody instrument, try playing an obscure song that only you and a few others know…I know that probably isn’t the best ettiquette, but you will be heard and at least you can introduce a new song to the session.

actually, these exist.

(1) get your normal battery-operated pickup.
(2) choose from one of several small amp/speakers, such as ones that clip to your belt.

saltcast, few instruments match my “celtic” model octave mandolin in tone. with a flat top. 😛

You’re probably right but the question here is VOLUME.
I wish I had one of those octave mandolin s too.

Salt

Volume is over-rated

Until you sit next to 3 accordian players 🙂

If I was in a session sitting next to 3 accordion players, I’d probably get very thirsty, or hungry, or need fresh air… maybe see a movie.

Hmmm. I’ve played with some mando players in a session, and I could hear them just fine. Maybe the instrumentalists you’re playing with are playing too loud? Assuming you’re playing a decent instrument with a stiff pick and adequate tempo and technique, another thing to consider may be that you simply aren’t hearing yourself well, but that everyone else hears you fine.

Putting a pickup on your instrument may lead to an arms race that ends only when everybody’s amplified. Of course, what happens next is that people start showing up with electric-only instruments, and then synthesizers, and then it’s no longer ITM.

Or is that another thread?

I sat next to three accordion players in a pub in Kinvara a few years back, and it was great fun. I could even hear myself play guitar.

The loudest acoustic instrument I’ve ever tried to accompany was a set of Scottish warpipes. It was just her and me, and I foolishly sat in back of her. I got blown off the stage--it was amazingly loud. It was a late night on St. Patrick’s Day, and everyone was beyond tipsy. Never again…

If the mandolin player can start turning up to a session with an amp, who’s to say the concertina player can’t have one - and the flute player, and the fiddler, and the piano boxer, and the egg shaker?

Personal amplification is a slippery slope.

There was an electric guitarist who used to show up at sessions here a few years ago. He had lived and played in the Shetlands a lot. He was blindingly good, played tunes not chords, and always had his little amp at just the right volume for playing with fiddles. Never a problem but he was a pro.

Learn the fiddle.