old masters?

In one of the other discussions (i think it was ‘….laid back’) someone mentioned about trying to be true to the tradition and about going back to listen to the old recordings from way back, as a way of holding onto the original sound. I think that that’s an important thing to do too, at least for me. I’m listening to all this galician and breton music these days and dont want to be too influenced by all these other sounds when I play something Irish. I do find it hard to get old stuff - so I was wondering if any of you have recomendations? I have a few cds of this stuff - the Michael Coleman 2 cd set, Hugh Gillespie ‘traditional recordings of irish fiddle music’, John Doherty ‘bundle and go’ and a recording of ‘the sliabh luachra fiddle master’, whose name I’m sorry to say I can’t recall at the moment. Please feel free to mention musicians other than fiddlers ; -).
pol

Hi Pol,

try the link below:

http://indigo.ie/~mulligan/ti.html

there is a lot of stuff listed here, but it includes info on the Tulla Ceili Band 50th anniversary album….now, that is trad dance at its best

regards,

Andy

Casey in the Cowhouse!

Bobby Casey, of course, playing by himself in a cowhouse. Really.

Also, I love Pat O’Connor, who is alive now and all that, but has a wonderful old style sound to him (old style Clare, anyway). You can get the CD at Custy’s Music in Ennis. http://www.custysmusic.com

Actually, Custy’s is a great place to get really good recordings it’d be hard to find anywhere else.

I also love Two Gentlemen of Clare -- check that one out too!

Of course, all of those are relatively new. What’s the collection with all those old masters on it, anyone remember? All I can think of is “Milestone”is in the title!?

Zina

The sliabh luacra master could well be Padraig O‘Keefe and you can also hear him on’Kerry Fiddles‘ with Denis Murphy and Julia Clifford. Denis and his sister are also on ’The Star Above The Garter’ if you like that style.
I like Andy McGann’s playing in ‘It’s a Hard Road to Travel’ and there’s also an album of him with Paddy Reynolds.
You might like Leo Rowsome’s ‘Classics of Irish Piping’.Or you may not. And a quick mention for ‘The Brass Fiddle’ where you can hear Con Cassidy,Vincent Campbell,Francie and James Byrne. Good luck!
Dave

it is Padraig O‘Keefe indeed. thanks folks - I found ’kerry fiddles‘ on Amazon - I love the kerry style, maybe its because I think slides and polkas work so well on the mandolin. Zina - it’s ’milestone at the garden: irish fiddle masters from the 78 rpm era’ and its also in my shopping cart!
thanks , pol

Pol, WHEN are you going to explain the mystery of your two names?

Zina

I can’t emphasis Michael Coleman enough, 50% of sets that are played commonly are taken directly from his recordings. The scratchy 78 sound as well as the occasional bad piano backups take a little to get past, but once you do you can here the fiddle come through. Every older player that I’ve ever had the pleasure of meeting has given me that same advice. For a newer recording of some great old style players I would pick up Andy McGann, Paddy Reynolds & Felix Dolan. The recording is clean & the music is top-notch.

However, the safest bet is to see if Green Linnett is pushing it, if they aren’t chances are that it’s a nice traditional album.

Oh yeah, Felix Dolan does a much better job than Columbia’s studio pianists.

One of my favourites, for slow airs, is Eugene O’Donell. Don’t think that you could class his music as session tunes, but it does echo of an earlier era

Brad,
I gotta agree with you about the piano playing on the Michael Coleman recordings, sheesh I’d do a better job myself and I cant play piano at all. I did enjoy that dig at them on Pat Reilly’s ‘2000 Years of Irish Music!’ that Zina told us about. Much easier on the ear is the guitar used on the Hugh Gillespie recordings.
Zina, well let me explain than. Its all the fault of the English really (of course ..) - All the old Gaelic names were anglicised when English became the predominant language - hence we have John Fitzgerald Kennedy instead of Sean MacGearalt O’Cinneide. That would have been ok except that when you learn Irish in school in Ireland, your teacher invariably addresses you by the Gaelic version. Well, being young and impressionable when I was in school (I’m old and impressionable now) I started using the Irish version as my signature, sort of as a nod to the language - without officially changing my name or anything, and still calling myself Paul not Pol.. But when I applied for my first passport some bright spark of a gaelgoir in the passport office took it on him- or herself to put the Irish version in there. Which didn’t bother me until I wanted visas to come over here and then it gets confusing cos my birth certificate and degree are in the english version ………. These days I use the English version when I play my electric rock guitar and the Irish one when I play my acoustic trad mandolin.
well, you had to ask ….. 😉
Pol

I really have to start learning Gaelic. My partner in the Cuirt House, Anne Marie Kennedy, teaches it, and keeps threatening to teach me, but past a word here and there, it never seems to happen. (She says I have a good ear, though.)

What I can’t figure out is stuff like why “Padraig” is pronounced “POR-ick”. It’s worst than French AND Chinese put together. Conal O’ Grada (who lives in the Muscra

Yes,Pol, just to say that I too have a lot of difficulty with those old recordings on account of the piano. In fact I recently gave away ‘Paddy in the Smoke’ to someone who can easily ignore it as I could n’t bear to listen to the vamp any more. My problem,I know, but I will persevere with the Michael Coleman recordings.
There’s a fairly recent play by a writer I can’t remember (and I can’t think of the title either!) and it’s set at the time when the old Irish place names were anglicised for the British army by the Ordnance Survey which is worth seeing if you ever get the chance.
Dave

Just thought of it: ‘Translations’ and I think it’s by Brian Friel.

Hughie Gillespie’s recordings are a a pretty good substitute for the Coleman 78’s, but his intonation wasn’t nearly the same. On many of Coleman’s sides (Especially hard to get home recordings) he had Paul Standeven play the Piano with much better results. Paddy Reynolds told me that when Michael Coleman went to the studio there was usually a studio pianist there (from the record co.) who had little or know idea of the finer points of backing Irish tunes. I think Coleman probably didn’t like the backups himself but no one has ever told me that for sure. If you want to check out a killer album of good old sligo music I would highly suggest the John Vesey album. Backups are almost all Paul Standeven or none at all. Also has a few tracks of Paul playing pipes (which are great) Well worth the listen

John Moulden has tapes for sale of field recordings and old records in a wide array. I have about six tapes, mostly singers, but some fiddlers. Some of these people achieved a bit of fame, like Sarah Makem and Elizabeth Cronin, but I also dearly love to listen to the old traveler fiddlers, who tell the story of the song first, then play it.
Here is a link:
www.folktrax.freeserve.co.uk/menus/a_z.htm

This is the tape I was listening to last night:
www.folktrax.freeserve.co.uk/menus/cassprogs/073.htm

quote "These are the earliest recordings of two members of the famous
Donegal family of musicians - Johnny, a travelling pedlar (’for every
fiddle tune a story’), with the first 7 items, followed by brother Mickey,
a travelling tinsmith or tinker - Both brothers fiddle but to every tune a
story - including three of the local ‘parables’ & ‘curses’ of St.Colmkille
- John has a lyrical fiddle style, whereas Mickey’s has the more
rhythmic dance quality. " end quote

pol, I just noticed in your first message that you mentioned John Doherty. It is John and his brother Michael who are the fiddlers on the tape I linked to above.

Alice

And then there’s Lucy Farr

Pol, I’m not sure if all of these are on the 2 CD set of Michael Coleman, but cassette tape is available from the above linked site of John Moulden’s:
www.folktrax.freeserve.co.uk/menus/cassprogs/154coleman.htm

The unfortunate piano back-ups seem to be mentioned everywhere, as here,
www.folktrax.freeserve.co.uk/menus/cassprogs/154.htm

Alice

There are also tapes of Michael Gorman at that site, including this one:
"Like Michael Coleman, Gorman (1902-69) was a pupil of the Co Sligo
fiddler, James Gannon. This is the earliest recording made by Peter
Kennedy, 1952, when Michael was a railway porter at London

Just a wee 2 cents on this conversation:
I found this cd about a year ago in some weird cd store…. it was for sale and I payed about 1 $ for it!
It includes very old tunes…… Most recordings are from about 1920 till 1930 and those people knew how to play… I’m talking bout people like James Morrison, John McKenna, Micheal Gaffney, William Mullaly, Ed Lee, P.J. Conlon, Patsy Touhey, Tom Carmody here and they are absolutely brilliant!

Irishdancer, what is the title of that CD compilation?

the cd is called dance music from Ireland. It has a drawing of a fiddler in the mountains on the front…… why?