The Milliner’s Daughter reel

What I really wanted to post was Liam Kelly out of Dervish -’s "Oh-my-God" version of this from "At The End Of The Day", but it’s one of those cases of either a session version or virtuosic showcase piece. Liam Kelly plays it as a double reel (as it is sometimes played at sessions) and it goes something like the following (with some of the grace notes omitted):

|:G2BG DG (3Bcd|{g}~a3g fdcA|FGBG dG (3Bcd|cAFG AG{A}GF|
GdBG DG (3Bcd|{g}~a3g fdcA|FG{A}GF D2Bd|cAFG AG{A}GF:|
|:d~g2f d~g2f|df~f2 d~f2e|d2gf ~g3f|d2de fdcA|
dg~g2 b2ag|e~f2e ~f3g|af{a}ge fd~e2|d2 (3efg fdcA:|

Does anyone here play this as a double or mixed single/double? I really like that 2nd part repeated…

nice tune dow

Notated by Pat Mitchell from a recording of Willie Clancy playing in Miltown Malbay at Easter 1971.
( graces notes omitted )

G|~G2BG DGBG|~A2eg fdcA|~G2BG DGBG|AD~F2 ABcA|
~G2BG DGBG|.A2~g2 fd^cA|~G2BG DGBG|cAFA AGG||
B||.dg~g2 .dg~g2|.de~f2 .de~f2|.dg~g2 .dg~g2|d^cde fdcA|
dg~g2 bgad|fdd(e~f3)g|af (3.g.f.e) fdec|d^cde fdcA||

… and another one: this is how John McEvoy tought it on Willie Clancy Week 03. I like the different ways part A goes in its first and second half

|:G2BG DGBG|A2 (3efg fdcA| G2BG DGAB| cAFG AGGF |!
G2BG DGBG|A2 (3efg fdcA | GB ~B2 dB ~B2 |1 cAFG AGGF:|2 cAFG AGGB|!
:dg~g2 dg~g2|df~f2 df~f2|dggf gagf|d^cde fd=cA|!
dg~g2 bgaf|d^cde f2 fg|afge fde^c|d2 eg fd=cA:||!
|"End"d2 eg fd=cA|G4 z4||!

*raises hand*
Double reel.

This is my interpretation of a Liam Kelly performance… I think it’s off of Spirit and it really rocks…

|:G2BG dGB/c/d | ~a3g fdcA | ~G3B dB/c/d | cAFG AGGF | GdBG DGB/c/d | A2eg fdcA | ~G3B dB/c/d |1 cAFG AGGF :|2 cAFG A~G3 | d~g3 dggf | d~f3 dffe | dGB/c/d ~g3f | ~d3e f/e/dcA | d~g3 b2ag | ~f3e fde/f/g | afge fd~e2 | d2e/f/g fdcA :|

I had always played this as a double reel, but more recently have heard it in my local session as a single reel. I prefer it as a double though.

I suspect this reel is related to fluters’ or pipers’ classics such as "Trim the Velvet," "Kiss the Maid behind the Barrel," and "the Steampacket." IMO this one would be an easy substitute for all the above, and a great tune for beginning flute players, including me.

Well, the tune closest to this is actually "the Green Groves of Erin": https://thesession.org/tunes/41 They are in fact identical tunes in different keys. If you have learned one but not the other yet, why not try and learn it? It’ll take just a minute. They really go nicely together, just like the Copperplates.

Here’s the version of the tune recorded by the Ballinakill Traditional Dance Players in 20’s or early 30’s.

K: Gmaj
G2BG DGBG|A2(3efg fdcA|G2BG DGBd|cAFG AGGF|
G2BG DGBG|A2(3efg fdcA|GB~B2 FA~A2|cAFG AGG2||
dg~g2 dg~g2|df~f2 df~f2|dg~g2 bgag|d^cde fd=cA|
dg~g2 bgag|d^cde ~f3g|afge fde^c|d^cde fd=cA||

You can actually listen to the historic recording of the legendary group: http://www.juneberry78s.com/sounds/ListenToIrishDance.htm

Yesterday I took one of the members of this site called "browndog" to the session I occasionally go. He played a similar version as a double. I believe he learned the tune from Ballinakill-born flute player Mike Rafferty, who in turn learned it from the Ballinakill Traditional Dance Players.

Hi Slainte!

Wow! Here it is almost two years later and I’m just now seeing your comment for the first time. I am honored to be mentioned by you. I still have wonderful memories of meeting you and attending your session.

In spite of all of the tunes that I learned from Mike Rafferty at Catskills Irish Arts Week in 2004, this was not one of them.

I learned this one in CIAW 2000, from Clare flute player, Siobhan Kelly — now living in New Jersey, USA with husband Willie (fiddler). Her setting is quite a finger-twister on flute, for me, but I love it.

お疲れ様です。

Messin’ with your minds… 😉

Just let me know when you’re back. We should swap some tunes.

I am learning Milliners daughter and have heard different conflicting versions from 2 conflicting sources.

ONeils…as well as the Session’s spots show the turn as follows
Key Gmaj
dg~g2 dg~g2| df~f2 df~f2| dg~g2 bgag|d^cde fd=cA|
dg~g2 bgag| d^cde ~f3|afge fde^c|d^cde fd=cA||

note that the fs are sharp according to the tunes key.

Paddy Obriens sesion tune book- which the folks I will be be playing with are planning to use is as follows

dg~g2 dg~g2| d=f~=f2 d=f~=f2| dg~g2 bgag|d^cde =fdcA|
dg~g2 bgag| d^cde ~f3|afge fde^c|d^cde fdcA||

O’brien’s spots have the fs specifically written as naturals. And even though the Session’s spots show the fs as sharp per the tune key, the one-finger piano version plays them as an f natural. Also, in the last bar, the cs are natural as per the key, not sharped as in ONeils and The Session tune library.

The naturals vs sharps in the turn make a big difference in the sound of hte tune. Any thoughts on this most appreciated

Thanks
zip

I learned it with the fs all sharp. And slightly different, like this:

dg~g2 dg~g2|df~f2 df~f2|dgg fg2ge|d^cde fd=cA|
dg~g2 bgag|dcde ~f3g|afge fde^c|d2 (3efg fd=cA||

I play it as Rev has it above.

But if all your friends play it with f nats, learn it that way, too. It’s not a bad thing to know several settings of the tunes you play—often comes in handy.

Without wanting to sound like an idiot…. what’s a turn?

Hah! You idiot!

🙂

Just kidding.

The "turn" is the second half of the tune; what brings you around to the beginning again.

Some people refer to just the last bar of a part as the turn, also.

So you can see that it’s a highly precise and technical term of art….

…and, just out of interest, what’s the ‘one-finger piano version’?

I’ve only ever heard it with F#s, but as Will says, learn to be flexible.

I love the philosophical discussion on the ‘turn’!

I gained a real warm spot for ‘the turn’ after seeing the movie Waking Ned Devine (I think I got that right-I am not much of a movie person)

Three competivive brothers…each with coeli bands in competition for the ‘worlds’. Typical cast-oldest has the farm and runs the neighborhood coeli. Second is a ne’er-do-well with a travelling coeli. The third is a missionary priest. The eldest and second are in a bitter struggle…sabatoging each others every move.

Winner of the competition-The priest brother whose coeli band consists of….African nationals shall we say from his parish in Africa that he taught ITM.

Best line of the movie. At the end, the three brothers have settled differences and are playing fiddle in front of the fire. Eldest brother stops the tune and says to the second brother, "Watch your timing. You always speed up in the ‘turn’ ".

I always hear that from my teacher!

I too have a band of E. coli hidden in me trousers. On this side of the pond, they call it a "skid mark." Never occurred to me to make a movie about it. Ewwww.


😀

Ceili….sorry

Everyone who reads my posts here knows I can neither type nor spell well or consistently!

S’all right. As long as you can take a little slagging and keep smiling.
🙂

granama

Somewhere on the Mustard Board there is a link or a recording of the tune. Someone kindly played it on-finger like and slowly.

It sounded like they were playing the fs nat

zipydw,

You are referring to the movie "The Boys and Girl of County Clare", about the three brothers. "Waking Ned Devine" is about the guy who died upon winning the lottery and the whole town conspires to get the payment. Both excellent movies, too!

It would be strange to have fnat’s in such a common tune, as they are difficult to play on some traditional instruments. So I will bet (without checking) that most of the recordings I know of this tune, if not all, use f#s, as in O’Neill’s (and also Henrik Norbeck), and that’s what I would choose if I were to introduce the tune to our session.

sixholes-

Probably right. I am a box player an the F is a pain in that arrangement. Thats why I was asking.

Greg

I said upfront, I was not a movie type. Herself teases me that there are very few movies I am not able to sleep through! Probably why I confused the two.

I probably woke up for the last line because I thought it was directed at me…as usual :-0

Would someone be kind enough to write out the chords for this tune in the key of G.
https://thesession.org/tunes/1409
I would like to enter it into Strum Machine for practice back-up.
I don’t have a tame guitarist handy..!! 😉
I’ve tried Google without success.
Thank you.

Until DonaldK gets his hands on it, these are utilitarian chords:

| G | Am D7 | G | D7 G |
| G | Am D7 | G | D7 G ||
| G | D | G | D F#m |
| G | D | D Em D A | G D7 |]

Ha ha, Nigel.

For the first setting, and staying quite simple, my "hand" on it would be something like:
| G | D | G | D G |
| G | D | G | D G ||
| G | D | G | A D |
| G | D | A | D ||

I knew that your chords would either be more sophisticated than mine, or simpler, but in either case better, DonaldK! I’m a lot better than I used to be, but it’s fair to say that chords are not my best suit. I’ve just transcribed Skinner’s "Les Trois Grand Luthiers" and there are combinations of notes which don’t suggest any chord; that’s where I get lost.

Thank you both Nigel and DonaldK for this information.
Much appreciated.
Is there a method or theory to writing/applying chords to a melody..?
Cheers.

"Is there a method or theory to writing/applying chords to a melody..?"

Wow! That’s not easy to answer. There are programs that will do it for you but I’m not impressed by what they produce. Some knowledge of harmonic theory undoubtably helps. But a mistake some people make is to look at the notes in a particular bar or half bar and identify what chord best fits the notes. I call this "harmony by eye". To me it can often lead to a disjointed chord progression which doesn’t progress, as it were.

I like to listen to a tune and "hear" a chord progression that makes sense of the tune - "harmony by ear". But to do this successfully you obviously have to be able to know what particular chord changes sound like. So , for example, if you’re listening to an accompanied tune, and given the key, you can identify all the chords the accompanist is using. This takes a lot of practice but, in my opinion, is well worth the effort.

So, for this tune, I just played along to the ‘play audio’ until I had something that sounded ok.