The Tinker’s Daughter reel

From the playing of Boys of the Lough. You can triplet almost any of the quarter notes, particularly those long A’s in the first half. (3ABA will give you a more lyrical feel at a loitering pace, and (3AAA punches the rhythm home at session speed.

You can also add some variety to the 1st and 5th measures of the first half by playing them |A2 FA DFAB|.

This tune was composed by Galway flute player, Vincent Broderick which is why it is often incorrectly called “Vincent Broderick’s”

This is not the McDermott’s hornpipe (actually two tunes) that Michael Coleman played.

Is this great tune merely a variant of “The Green Mountain”?

I CAN SEE HOW MUCH YOU STUDY, IT IS AMAZING!!! BUFFF!!!

The version in Vincent Broderick’s book, the Turoe Stone, does not have Will’s 2nd time ending on the B-part. Most versions I’ve heard have a distinctive repeated phrase in bars 3 & 4 of the B-part that goes something like this |f2df e2de|f2df edBd|, or as written in the book |f2df efdf|f2df edBd|.

So, Dow, are you saying it goes more like:

X: 1
T: Tinker’s Daughter, The
M: 4/4
L: 1/8
C: Vincent Broderick
K: D
A2 FA DAFA|defd efdB|A2 FA DAFA|B2 dB BAFB|
A2 FA DAFA|defd efde|faaf bfaf|1 (3efe de fedB:|2 (3efe de fdde||
faaf bfaf|defd (3efe de|f2 df efde|f2 df edBd|
faaf bfaf|defd (3efe de|f2 df efdB|1 AFEF D2 de|2 AFEF DAdB||

Yeah, actually this:

X: 1
T: Tinker’s Daughter, The
M: 4/4
L: 1/8
C: Vincent Broderick
K: Dmaj
dB|:A2FA DFAd|f2fd efdc|A2FA DAFA|B2dB BAFB|
A2FA DFAd|f2fd efd2|faaa b2af|e2de fdd2:|
|:faaa baaf|dfaf e2de|f2df efdf|f2df edBd|
faaa baaf|dfaf e2de|f2df efdB|AFEG FDD2:|

My teacher Chris Droney wanted me to get the notes of this tune and when i was asking about the curious name, he said that Vincent(I think im correct now)asked Chris to help in naming it and then a woman fron the travelling community came to the door enquring for food.As she had her daughter with her the name arose from that!!!

These three reels are structurally very close (they even share whole bars and beats):
The Green Mountain https://thesession.org/tunes/166
The Maid Behind the Bar https://thesession.org/tunes/64
The Tinker’s Daughter: https://thesession.org/tunes/353
They are all very popular, often played and, I assume, rarely confused with one another: I wonder how many musicians have realised how similar they are ‘on paper’?

see also: The Silver Spear https://thesession.org/tunes/182

A call to all you verteran fiddlers out there….could you suggest possible bowing patterns for the opening bar of Tinker’s Daughter? I’ve got a couple I’m trying out [and sometimes even varying throughout the tune and the 2nd pass] but I’m just wondering if my hunches about how I’m hearing it played are more or less accurate [hard to tell exactly on the Comhaltas session version since you can’t really hear the fiddle]

the notes are:

|:A2 FA DAFA|defd efdB|

it’s possible permutations for the x-bowing I’m after.

thanks.

* pours a nice cup of coffee, unfolds deckchair, and sits back to enjoy the fun *

Jeeves…“fun”? On The Session? are you sure!?

These gents any help? Tune starts around 1:05 or so with a close up of the fiddler too:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKYZD5RgVCk

play video

Ian,
the interesting thing is all 3 fiddlers are playing it slightly/majorly differently! maybe that answers my question after all. ;)
ha!

* rousing himself out of the deckchair *

In the absence of input from Tom, Dicks and Wills and at the risk of being told by Michael that any such advice is useless in print - and I tend to agree with him BTW - here’s my two pennorth:

Although I generally use a fair bit of slurred cross-bowing in those “rocking across the strings” figures, in a passage like that I would bow every note in the first bar separately - down for the long A, and then up-down etc. for the others.

Hitting the strong offbeats with an up-bow, where the pedal (that is, the A) is on a higher string, lets you dig in (just catching the A string at the same time) in a way that is both softer and dirtier than the effect you would generally get by using a down bow. Works for me.

One permutation out of several dozen.

thanks Jeeves. Unlike Michael, I don’t entirely think it’s a useless exercise [if he actually does], as youtube vids and your one suggestion [out of many] prove. If nothing else it provides a variation which is what keeps things fun and interesting for player and punter alike seems to me. I like the soft and dirty aspect of it too. Hadn’t thought of it in those terms. Grist for the mill. cheers,

Think less in terms of patterns and more in terms of all the possible single bow and slur combinations. Try them all, suss out what sounds best to you (it may not be the most intuitive or “natural” --for you-- way to bow the phrase). The main thing is to listen to how different combos of singles and slurs affects the pulse. And then decide how many of these bowings suit your sense of what the tune ought to sound like.

FWIW, some common ways to bow that phrase:

1. As Jeeves says, single bows through the whole A2 FA DAFA bit, with up bows on the As and down bows on the Fs and D.

2. Down on the first A2 and slur onto the F, still down. Then up on A and the rest bowed as in #1 above.

3. Pedal bow it: up on A2, down on F, slur up on ADA, down on F, up on the last A.

4. Down on A2 then up slur the FA together, then down on D and single bow the rest (uA dF uA)

5. Pedal bow differently: Down on A2, slur up FA, then down on D, and pedal slur up on AFA

6. Up on A2, up slur FA, up slur DA, down on F, up on A

Other “permutations” are of course possible, but I would use most or all of the above bowings in playing such a phrase.

Thanks Will. Btw…that advice you gave way back was invaluable. Got me set in the right direction. It all made sense after that. It was the perfect template for many other aspects of the music. Much appreciated.

@ Will…I have indeed tried some of these patterns you suggest above albeit with slight variations. But not all of them. Excellent. Helps confirm that my hunches about “the sound” that each produces is the way to go….that ultimately it’s a matter of personal taste and hearing what your ear likes while also developing a style, and, sometims I think too some variations have to hinge on one’s technical ability at the time in one’s development. Diff bowings produce diff sounds, but also diff challenges technically…but it’s all good and probably good not to have just *one* way, but many ways. Thanks again.

@Will « 1. As Jeeves says, single bows through the whole A2 FA DAFA bit, with up bows on the As and down bows on the Fs and D. »

Actually that’s the opposite of what I said (or thought I said). I would take the Fs and Ds with up bows - quite a different attack. Softer, but more urgent.

Oops. Yep. Sorry Jeeves. Either way works a treat, just different emPHASis, eh?

mtodd, I’ve learned the most from woodshedding a bit on things that felt awkward at first, instead of following the familiar path of least resistance. I can think of a few bowing ideas that felt impossible at first that now feel like the most natural thing in the world.

And for common phrases such as this one, even in my early years, I tried to have at least 2 or 3 ways to bow them, right from the start.

Glad to help.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3nxiCjDALI&list=UUXYxaI20Mqdx4UIjyg8_bRw&index=1

play video

I’m very glad I discovered this. I can’t figure out, however, which one is Will. I look forward to applying my bow once again to this tasty tune armed with the above advice. Thank you!

I know it as Vincent Broderick’s Reel.
In the second bar I play frolld efd.
As a variation I also do f-fd efd.
In the seventh bar I play faroll baaf
I was going to add a setting but I only know the first part and it is too complicated for me to add a setting with all the bits and pieces you have to press!