i posted this in the comments of another tune, and was told to correct it and put it here. So here it is, enjoy!
“Cnoc na gCláraċ”
K: E Dorian
(While the A-part has that Mix feel, I’m basing the E Dorian take on the final resolution being an ‘e’ in the B-part.)
|: e3 e2 e d2 f e2 d | c2 A B2 A a3 a2 g |
efe efe d2 f e2 d | c2 A B2 ^G A3 A3 :|
e2 a a2 g e2 d Bcd | e2 a a2 g e2 g d2 f |
e2 a a2 g e3 efe | d2 d e2 f g3 f2 g :|
Finishing ~ | d2 d e2 f g3 f2 g | e3- e3 z3 z3 ||
“Cnoc na gCláraċ” ~ “An Pota Stóir:
Ceol Seite Corca Duibne/The Set Dance Music of West Kerry"
Feargal Mac Amhlaoibh
Page 41, #71: "Cnoc na gCláraċ" / "Knocknaglarach"
“Cnoc na gCláraċ” ~ another key
K: A Dorian
|: A3 ABA G2 B A2 G | F2 D DDD d3 c2 B |
ABA AAA G2 B A2 G | FED EEE D3 D3 :|
A2 d d2 c A2 G EEE | A2 d d2 c AAA G3 |
A2 d d2 c ABA ABA | GAG GAB c2 d B2 c :|
Finishing ~ | GAG GAB c2 d B2 c | A3- A3 a z2 z3 ||
i think i got them all in on time, you lucky i wasn’t doin’ anything;-)
Just a short one on that last one, as to drop to a low C is a nice touch, second bar, second beat ~ DCD … and also possible ~ B,CD …
“Johnny O’Leary of Sliabh Luachra:
Dance Music from the Cork-Kerry Border"
~ edited by Terry Moylan
The Lilliput Press, Dublin, 1994
Page 49, Tune #86: Padraig O’Keeffe’s Favourite
“Treoir” ~ the magazine of Comhaltas Ceoltóirí Eireann (CCE)
Volume 34, #4, 2002
"The Brosna Slide 2"
K: E Dorian
|: e3 efe d2 f e2 d | c2 A ABA a3 a2 g |
e3 efe d2 f e2 d | c2 A BAG A3 A2 A :|
|: e2 a a2 g e2 d Bcd | e2 a a2 g efe d2 f |
e2 a a2 g e3 efe | d3 def g2 f g2 e :|
Denis Doody ~ also in his repertoire, but he hadn’t a name for it…
Denis has a huge store of tunes, including many slides and polkas… Much of his repertoire he hadn’t and hasn’t a name for. He’s not alone… When doing the above recording the folks putting it together didn’t want an LP full of gan ainms so asked him to ‘fill in the blanks’, which he did. Later he felt the consequence when people started making requests ~ "Huh?" In other words ~ "Can you hum a few bars…" Denis Doody is one of the finest exponents of this music on the two-row, up there with Johnny O’Leary, Jimmy Doyle, Jackie Daly and the rest ~ and I hope in the future his recordings are reissued so others can appreciate the man’s music… You just want to be part of it, through joining in on the music or the dance, or just tapping your foot…
Learnt by ear from Ceoltoiri Langhain
|: a2 f |
e3 efe d2 f e2 d | c2 d e2 f a3- a2 f |
e3 efe d2 f e2 d | c2 d B2 c A3 :|
|: c2 d |
e2 a a2 g e2 d c2 d | e2 a a2 g e3 d3 |
e2 a a2 g e2 d c2 d | c2 d e2 f g3 :|
Here is my version, with thanks to ‘c’ for sorting out the abc. I learnt it from a Ceoltoiri Langhain recording but as with learning by ear, it differs a good deal. Anyway, Happy to Contribute and thanks for the names. Finally!!
Also CL played this one very fast so that why it sounds slightly more like a reel in my head than an normal slide.
Hey ‘c’, I heartily disagree with your choice of mode. Rather than determining choice of mode by "resolution", I prefer to view it in terms of changing "moods" or "colours". This one might end on an "e", but it doesn’t resolve to it; to me it hangs unresolved.
You just like things unresolved you do… It’s a tough call, the A-part being basically A Mix in feel, but the B-part not… However, it finishes with the B-part, and I have a few recordings where they saw it down to the e for a finish, as shown above. So, rather than base it on my less than reliable tendencies, I based it one someone else’s… Oh yeah, I just remembered, I’ve got Johnny O’Leary’s take on it to add here next. Thanks for the kick up the backside Dow… :-P
I have seen a number of ABC’s for this one where the people doing the notation had it down as A Mixolydian…for the records…
The B-part is Amix too, though. The reason you have seen abc’s where people had it down as A mixolydian is because, um, it *is* in A mixolydian :-)
I know, I know, but sometimes, in some versions, while the A-part is in A Mix, sometimes even hinting a A Major even, sometimes, just sometimes, it tells me it’s over on e… And some folks have finished it there, but maybe also, that can feel like leaving it ‘hanging’ ~ as you believe, unresolved. It might just be the toxins working on confusing me… ;-) In some instances it just felt somehow right, or stubborn, to feel a resolution on the e, to treat the tune in some of its forms as making a change from A Mix in the A-part to an E Dorian feel in the B-part ~
Damned academics… Who? Me? Not likely, I can’t afford ivory either… What does it really matter, it’s two sharps ~ well, it does, especially if you’re going to pull a decent accompaniment for it. Anyway, I found some notes for Johnny O’Leary’s playing. This was one of the tunes I learned from the man himself, dancing to his playing and playing the tunes with him… He had a wonderful way with this music and lots of little variaitions, so I will try to give a little bit of an idea of some of those ways, and hopefully I’ll do a reasonable job at it… He was a grand man, husband, father, citizen, musician…
“Padraig O’Keefe’s Favourite” ~ Johnny O’Leary
K: left unresolved ~ to meet Dow’s needs…
( or A Mixolydian if that will make him happier… :-P )
~ however, there’s two sharps, sometimes three…
~ and Johnny favoured ending it on A…
e3- efe dcd e2 d | c2 A cBA a3- a2 g |
e2 e gfe dcd fed | c2 A B2 ^G A3- A3 |
e3 efe d2 f e2 d | c2 A B2 A a3 a2 g |
efe gfe dcd fed | cBA BA^G A3 A3 ||
e2 a a^ga e2 d Bcd | e2 a a^ga e2 =g d3 |
e2 a a2 g e2 f gfe | d2 A def g2 g f2 g |
e2 a a^ga e2 d Bcd | e2 a a^ga e2 =g d2 f |
e2 a a2 g e3 efe | d2 A def gfg faf ||
& another way he might end the B-part…
e2 a a2^g aga b2 a | gfg e2 f g3 faf ||
& oneway of bringing a set to an end with this slide ~
ending on A…
| d2 A def g3 f3 || e3 A3- A3- A z2 ||
Hell, there aren’t enough Mixolydian tunes about anyway… So that low A Dorian way up top there will become D Mixolydian….
LOL. Well there’s a simple way to resolve the issue. A tune (or part of a tune) can only be viewed to be in E dorian provided that it is possible to come up with a convincing E dorian chord sequence/progression on an accompanying instrument, i.e. one with a bass that moves sufficiently and resolves in a way that is pleasing to the ear. I argue that in this case, you can’t. Despite the fact that the B-part begins on e, that very first perfect 4th interval from e to a is a strong dominant-tonic movement that instantly reinforces the Amix feel of the A-part for my ear*. If you were backing it, your only other option would be an F#m7 chord which is the relative minor of A; this would make the ear hear the B-part as F# phrygian, which would need to be resolved back to A again.
*Incidentally, if it had gone e to g or e to b, or indeed e to anything else like f# then you could consider other options than I or VI.
Damn, after all that I can’t end it on e anymore… Boo hoo! All those a’s and A’s. What will be will be, I just have to let go ~ AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!! :-(
Ouch! You were supposed to catch me… I’ve been drinking lots and lots of water and the toxins are beginning to wear off ~ my senses are clearing… Thanks for help with the detox…
You can still end it on e. And actually there’s nothing to stop you using Edorian progressions in the B-part if you want to back it that way and can be bothered to come up with a sequence of chord changes that hangs together, but you’ll never get it to suggest E dorian strongly by starting and/or ending that B-part on a chord of Em because the contour of the melody isn’t underlyingly E dorian. It will just sound as though you’re using an Em drone either as 1) a deliberately unresolved "hanging" on the dominant of the underlying mode, which is Amix, or possibly also as 2) a passing tone colour in the context of another mode, like phrygian or lydian ;-)
Sorry ‘c’, I’ve been working* on my thesis all day and I’m in a brain fever and can’t sleep. I’ll try and shut up :-)
* read: "coming out with bullsh*t for the purpose of…"
How do you do footnotes on this bloody website?
Don’t you dare shut up… As if you could… :-P
I should be clear about what’s happening with me this month and into July. You know that hay fever asthma shight, well, ever since a case of pneumo one of my ears has tinnitus, and for some damn reason it is really loud lately ~ AND ~ IT IS BLOOD A=440 and driving me starkers. So, ending anything on an E or an e at least gives me some partial relief…. Life is strange ain’t it…
In your case I’m pretty sure that’s the case, yes. *smirk*
Why did I even mention lydian earlier. That has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Hah. I think I might have a cup of tea.
I don’t want to sound pedantic here, I’m just genuinely curious. Um, ‘c’, when you say "starkers", I’m assuming it’s not causing you to strip your clothes off. You mean "stark raving mad", right? Please tell me you do or I’ll *really* start to worry about you.
I think tinnitus is the least of your problems :-)
Maybe a bit of both… Yuck, I hate even thinking that scene… Hey, as long as you keep this just between us I won’t mention that slide you barred one beat off… ;-)
I don’t like the sound of that either… :-P
“Cnoc na gCláraċ” ~ NOT DORIAN! ~ guilty as charged…by myself…
I started this off, the asking and correcting, but I got it wrong, taking the key as given ~
Sometimes I have too much faith, this tune isn’t Dorian, or E… The so-tagged E Dorian, which I’d accepted without my usual skepticism, is A Mixolydian, and that other version listed as A Dorian is D Mixolydian.
“Patsy Healy’s” ~ brought backward from a future duplication
Key signature: A Mixolydian
Submitted on July 23rd 2006 by Ptarmigan.
T: Patsy Healy’s
K: A Mixolydian
|: e3 efe ded e2 d | c2 A B2 A a3 a2 g |
e3 efe ded e2 d | c2 A BcB A3 ABd :|
|: e2 a a2 g e2 d Bcd | e2 a a2 g e2 g d2 g |
e2 a a2 g e2 f gfe | d2 d def g2 e f2 d :|
Ptarmigan had the tune written out without repeats, as a full 32 bars, but there was no difference between the repeats given except for a couple of notes in the repeat of the B-part, bar 3, beats 3 & 4:
| e2 a a2 g e2 e efe |
"Dan Herlihy collected this tune from the Knocknagoshal area of Co. Kerry." ~ Ptarmigan
# Posted on July 23rd 2006 by Ptarmigan
I’ve just had one of those moments ~ an hour’s worth of sneezing, runny and itchy eyes and shortness of breath. I wish to hell the pollen would leave me alone. July is often the worst of it, but so far not so bad I couldn’t sleep, knock on wood… August approaches… That reminds me, I need to give this monitor a good wipe down… ;-)
Ptarm, your secret is safe with me…
N>NN ~ swinging along ~
Comment on Ptarm’s contribution above, it was very late and I was sneezing up a storm in china (remember the beating wings of a butterfly?) ~ anyway, I said 32 bars, but that would only apply to 6/8, so 12/8 is 16 bars, but ~ without showing any illustration, the actual transcript reworked was originally 8 bars of 24/16, or thereabouts. Maybe it was a holiday in the Balkans he’d come back from… ~ great tune however you swing it.
And with that, some folks do occasionally add an internal swing on a group of three notes ~ NNN to N>NN in the jig family of tunes, including slides…but the general practice is not to transcribe those moments…
Comhaltas video - the 3rd tune
A slide from Terry Teahan from the album "Old Time Irish Music in America" (Topic 1977). The sleeve notes state, "Reagan was a concertina player from Brosna. He’s dead and gone now."
Reagan’s = O’Keeffe’s
Nigel, I am intrigued by your first part. It is a tone higher than I would expect, being familiar with the tune as played by Jackie Daly.
In his setting the parts are reversed, and the turn (your first part) is in A rather than B (i.e. starting e2a rather than f2b). Jackie refers to it as one of O’Keeffe’s (presumably referring to Padraig O’K). It must already be in the database here, a well-known tune.
Now Bohola recorded the tune as Reagan’s and also reverse the parts. On listening to the track, I note that they play the turn (your first part) in A… and then in B. The Chicago connection, tip of the hat to T. Teahan?
Here’s a well-known outfit giving it a go, together with the other O’Keeffe’s that Jackie Daly also plays with it. (Ceoltóirí Laighean. And Scattery Island slide is indeed a different tune.)
Here it is!
You beat me to it Jeeve Stones… :-D
X: 8 “The Brosna” ~ No. 3
S: “Jimmy Doyle & Dan O’Leary: Traditional Music From The Kingdom Of Kerry”
https://thesession.org/recordings/1247 ~ track 5, the 3rd slide of 3
Mixolydian ~ :-/
Mixolydian ~ Mixolydian ~ Mixolydian ~ Duh! :-P
Q: 145 bpm (1 beat = three quavers/eigth notes)
I have also learned this one direct, as well from other living sources and situations where the average tempos varied from 130 to 150 bpm (1 beat = three quavers/eighth notes)…